Bad luck with JJ ecc83s

  • Thread starter Thread starter LP Freak
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NowYou'rePlayingWithPower said:
Nobody in the big picture cares about guitar amp valve tubes. They aren't going to lose millions of dollars to feed a niche to make a handful of people happy. Somehow I doubt that when WWIII breaks out anybody with money is going to be kicking themselves for not investing. Hopes and dreams don't make reality.
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The way I see it is your either for the Status Quo, relying on China/Russia/Slovakia and kicking the can down the road until it's too late...... supporting the unsustainable........ and that's okay.

Or your for supporting other viable means and options for tubes...... me I'm for more viable means and options and doing the responsible thing.
 
The~Kid said:
The way I see it is your either for the Status Quo, relying on China/Russia/Slovakia and kicking the can down the road until it's too late...... supporting the unsustainable........ and that's okay.

Or your for supporting other viable means and options for tubes...... me I'm for more viable means and options and doing the responsible thing.
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Well, take your $50m and turn it into $5m over the next 20 years. 🤷‍♀️ It has nothing to do with "status quo," Daniel. The world revolves around $ not pipe dreams.
 
dcburn said:
Fairly certain the environmental impact of tube production is also part of the reason...
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Yeah probably same reason you can't make glass bottles in CA or it's so expensive they just dont make them here due to the "environment impact"......

Not saying all environmental laws are stupid and we have sustainable woods for a reason to preserve the woods for the next generation but I mean tubes could probably be made cleaner today than back then. Also some environmental laws are pretty dumb just look at Prop 65 in CA for example or what it requires to put up a Solar Panel in CA........... You probably need to get through more red tape than getting a license for a new oil rig going.


In the grand scheme of things what amount of impact if any would tubes have vs the impact lithium batteries have on the environment or the mining of other rare earth metals or just about well anything else.
 
The~Kid said:
but I mean tubes could probably be made cleaner today than back then
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Problem is, whenever they talk about tube production again in the States, the plan always seems to be using the old tube machinery to produce them again.
There never seems to be a plan to reinvent the wheel, design new machinery, so to speak...
 
dcburn said:
Hard to fight a goventmental agenda.
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I mean not sure about "agenda" or whatever but........

I'm pretty sure a modern day cellphone has a larger impact on the environment than any tube that could be made in the States could have yet no one ever brings up that inconvenient truth...... the Earth doesn't strip itself of rare earth metals to make them now does it :dunno:


I'm not saying environmental laws don't have their place like hell I'm all for solar panels right or preserving woods so the next generation could get to play guitars too but I mean some of this stuff is just ridiculous. And yeah maybe won't see tube production back in the States but it can probably be done in India, Mexico, Vietnam etc etc.
 
dcburn said:
Problem is, whenever they talk about tube production again in the States, the plan always seems to be using the old tube machinery to produce them again.
There never seems to be a plan to reinvent the wheel, design new machinery, so to speak...
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Because it's too costly. There will likely never be a profit with a new facility.
 
dcburn said:
Problem is, whenever they talk about tube production again in the States, the plan always seems to be using the old tube machinery to produce them again.
There never seems to be a plan to reinvent the wheel, design new machinery, so to speak...
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This, I wouldn't expect that neither should anyone.....


Why in the world would you run a modern manufacturing process like you would 100+ years ago...... fully automated or pretty much fully automated would be the best way to make them. It would be more cost efficient too and just much more efficient in general than the current way they make them in China and I imagine in Russia or Slovakia as well and you'd get a better and more consistent quality product as well in the end.
 
The~Kid said:
This, I wouldn't expect that neither should anyone.....


Why in the world would you run a modern manufacturing process like you would 100+ years ago...... fully automated or pretty much fully automated would be the best way to make them. It would be more cost efficient too and just much more efficient in general than the current way they make them in China and I imagine in Russia or Slovakia as well and you'd get a better and more consistent quality product as well in the end.
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See Lisa's post above yours.
Too costly and not enough demand.
 
The~Kid said:
I mean not sure about "agenda" or whatever but........

I'm pretty sure a modern day cellphone has a larger impact on the environment than any tube that could be made in the States could have yet no one ever brings up that inconvenient truth...... the Earth doesn't strip itself of rare earth metals to make them now does it :dunno:


I'm not saying environmental laws don't have their place like hell I'm all for solar panels right or preserving woods so the next generation could get to play guitars too but I mean some of this stuff is just ridiculous. And yeah maybe won't see tube production back in the States but it can probably be done in India, Mexico, Vietnam etc etc.
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Rochester, NY gave a bunch of money to bring in and help fund a brand new lithium recycling facility.
Promises a whole bunch of new jobs.
Not sure it even opened before very recently going bankrupt.

Not sure that lithium is the answer to all our problems.
 
The~Kid said:
Yeah....... the there isn't demand argument...... apparently China/Russia/Slovakia just make tubes for no reason then.....
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They already exist and they produce tubes for military applications. Audio tube demand is declining. It's not an argument, it's a reality. Not sure why you believe that anyone would or even should spend tens of millions of $ to lose most of it. 🤷‍♀️
 
dcburn mk.ii said:
Rochester, NY gave a bunch of money to bring in and help fund a brand new lithium recycling facility.
Promises a whole bunch of new jobs.
Not sure it even opened before very recently going bankrupt.

Not sure that lithium is the answer to all our problems.
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It was just a comment regarding rare earth metals in general and that there is all this other stuff we use that has as bad or much much worse environmental impact than a glass bottle with metal bits and filaments in them.
 
Is this guy arguing with himself or what the hell is going on :dunno: :unsure::ROFLMAO:
 
The~Kid said:
Yeah....... the there isn't demand argument...... apparently China/Russia/Slovakia just make tubes for no reason then.....
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How many tubes do you think get made yearly against how many just get relabeled?
And Russia probably still has machinery that runs off tubes.

But demand in America?
Popular Mechanics isnt popular anymore.
HAM radio the same.
I don't believe the military uses tube components anymore.
Pretty sure organs are more solid state than tube driven today...

This is just my formed opinion on the matter, doesnt mean its gospel...
 
NowYou'rePlayingWithPower said:
They already exist and they produce tubes for military applications. Audio tube demand is declining. It's not an argument, it's a reality. Not sure why you believe that anyone would or even should spend tens of millions of $ to lose most of it. 🤷‍♀️
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Not everything is just about money though....... and maybe it seems improbable or impossible but it wouldn't be so bad if anyone did...... even if it meant "failure".

IMO there will still be a need and use for tubes in the future even with advancements in tech now. Maybe we can keep kicking the can down the road perpetually forever on Chinese/Russian/Slovakian tubes..... or everything will just go digital by that point given no other real options..... but something tells me whatever the case tubes will still be relevant.
 
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