Bad luck with JJ ecc83s

[The~Kid]

Well, since apparently there's money in it based on your vast research, I can only assume it's a conspiracy and has nothing at all to do with the fact that it costs tens of millions to open a factory and would take decades to recoup or that both of those countries heavily use tubes in military applications to this day.

Well there seems to be a market and money in it ..... why the fuck else are they making them whatever the reason may be.

IMO it's just lazy on the part of the music industry as a whole, it's irresponsible and it's unsustainable and the industry needs other options outside of garbage tubes being made in Slovakia or tubes being made by countries that aren't exactly Americas best friend like China/Russia.....


These are the only options for American Amp manufacturers from the big guns like Fender/MESA and the Big Boutiques..... they seek to keep it that way and keep the Status Quo I guess...... IMO it's kind of BS and consumers and the industry should have other options and that's all I am saying.

 

[NowYou'rePlayingWithPower]

Well there seems to be a market and money in it ..... why the fuck else are they making them whatever the reason may be.

IMO it's just lazy on the part of the music industry as a whole, it's irresponsible and it's unsustainable and the industry needs other options outside of garbage being made in Slovakia or tubes being made by countries that aren't exactly Americas best friend like China/Russia.....


These are the only options for American Amp manufacturers from the big guns like Fender/MESA and the Big Boutiques..... they seek to keep it that way and keep the Status Quo...... IMO it's kind of BS and consumers and industry should have other options and that's all I am saying.

If you spent half as much time playing the guitar as you do feign and do no harm trolling, you would be pretty amazing.

 

[The~Kid]

If you spent half as much time playing the guitar as you do feign and do no harm trolling, you would be pretty amazing.

All I'm saying is its not exactly responsible on the part of the music industry and these are the only options now. Garbage tubes made in Slovakia or tubes from China/Russia not exactly Americas best friends here.....


It's lazy and the music industry could do better in 2025.

 

[The~Kid]

Indonesia makes good guitars...... Can't they make good tubes too or like anywhere else not China/Russia/Slovakia

 

[NowYou'rePlayingWithPower]

All I'm saying is its not exactly responsible on the part of the music industry and these are the only options now. Garbage tubes made in Slovakia or tubes from China/Russia not exactly Americas best friends here.....


It's lazy and the music industry could do better in 2025.

So tell them. I'm no friend of either of those countries, but you aren't going to build a factory and profit in a reasonable amount of time that anyone short a few brain cells would invest in. Unless of course you believe there's a large market for $200-300/piece preamp tubes. This isn't a growing industry.

 

[NowYou'rePlayingWithPower]

Indonesia makes good guitars...... Can't they make good tubes too or like anywhere else not China/Russia/Slovakia

Again, it's not about the "Can" it's about the $.

 

[The~Kid]

So tell them. I'm no friend of either of those countries, but you aren't going to build a factory and profit in a reasonable amount of time that anyone short a few brain cells would invest in. Unless of course you believe there's a large market for $200-300/piece preamp tubes. This isn't a growing industry.

Again, it's not about the "Can" it's about the $.

Well it's complicated and I don't know...... all I'm saying is there should be other options.

Until then I guess all I'm using are Chinese/Russian tubes reluctantly because these are the only good tubes being made now. I ain't buying JJ/Slovakian tubes, I tried to, I tried to like them....... but tone is tone and the Chinese/Russian stuff is just that much better.


The quality is great and I'm not complaining there, just wish there were other options and until then yeah I guess the only real options are Chinese/Russian tubes IMO.

 

[The~Kid]

And it isn't like Fender being the largest amp manufacturer or places like Mesa that order a bunch of tubes too have no say on the matter or you know like the "Boutique Factory" where a lot of the big Boutique names simply make the same amps under the same house and OEMs pretty much for Boutique Brands...... or SweetWater/GC and others.........


It's pretty lazy IMO that no real effort is being made by the music industry to find other avenues for tubes.


They have zero say and zero responsibility here........ I mean I call BS and I'm not saying it's easy or not complicated as to why we are here but maybe we need more viable options other than the trash being made in Slovakia by JJ or tubes from Russia and China for obvious reasons

 

[NowYou'rePlayingWithPower]

And it isn't like Fender being the largest amp manufacturer or places like Mesa that order a bunch of tubes too have no say on the matter or you know like the "Boutique Factory" where a lot of the big Boutique names simply make the same amps under the same house and OEMs pretty much for Boutique Brands...... or SweetWater/GC and others.........


It's pretty lazy IMO that no real effort is being made by the music industry to find other avenues for tubes.


They have zero say and zero responsibility here........ I mean I call BS and I'm not saying it's easy or not complicated to why we are here but maybe we need more viable options other than the trash being made in Slovakia by JJ or tubes from Russia and China for obvious reasons

What obvious reasons? Find a marketable use for tubes outside of amplifiers in the US that can also be considered power saving/green/energy efficient, and maybe audio tubes would be produced as a byproduct. Otherwise $. Show them the $. It's all about the $. Show them a business plan that includes a solid growth model and breaking even in 36 months instead of 3,600. I'm sure they and many others will be happy to jump on board.

 

[The~Kid]

What obvious reasons? Find a marketable use for tubes outside of amplifiers in the US that can also be considered power saving/green/energy efficient, and maybe audio tubes would be produced as a byproduct. Otherwise $. Show them the $. It's all about the $. Show them a business plan that includes a solid growth model and breaking even in 36 months instead of 3,600. I'm sure they and many others will be happy to jump on board.

Obvios reason being well China/Russia aren't Americas best friend and that JJ/Slovakian tubes are garbage and these are the only places we can get tubes in 2025........ it's a pretty fragile supply chain as well......


China/Russia/Slovakia seem to think there is money in it...... and that's the reason they make them to make money.....


I mean make them in Fort Wayne Indiana or in SoCal CA or in Texas or Missouri or something..... if not Mexico, India, Indonesia or Vietnam could probably them as good or better than Russia/China and bring as much or more ROI than the ones currently being made there in the long run as the industry grows along with population.

 

[NowYou'rePlayingWithPower]

Obvios reason being well China/Russia aren't Americas best friend and that JJ tubes are garbage and these are the only places we can get tubes in 2025.


I mean make them in Fort Wayne Indiana or in SoCal CA or in Texas or something..... if not Mexico, India, Indonesia or Vietnam could make them as good or better than Russia/China and bring as much or more ROI than the ones currently being made there in the long run as the industry grows along with population.

The industry isn't growing. That's the point. It has nothing to do with geopolitics and everything to do with $.
If I asked you to invest a minimum of $30-40m and your first $ of profit was never, you would be cool with that, right?

 

[The~Kid]

The industry isn't growing. That's the point. It has nothing to do with geopolitics and everything to do with $.
If I asked you to invest a minimum of $30-40m and your first $ of profit was never, you would be cool with that, right?

The industry is growing and the pandemic showed so.......

Electric Guitar is growing..... and there is money to be made...... and Tubes will always be a part of the Electric Guitar.


I like digital stuff and it's awesome, but the tube is still the standard and will be for the forseable future especially as the modeling stuff is hitting a wall and as good as it is probably won't or can't get any better.


Electric Guitar is still growing and it's the future and tubes are still relevant probably now more than ever with the growth and gains in the industry since and after the pandemic.

 

[NowYou'rePlayingWithPower]

The industry is growing and the pandemic showed so.......

Electric Guitar is growing..... and there is money to be made...... and Tubes will always be a part of the Electric Guitar.


I like digital stuff and it's awesome, but the tube is still the standard and will be for the forseable future especially as the modeling stuff is hitting a wall and as good as it is probably won't or can't get any better.


Electric Guitar is still growing and it's the future and tubes are still relevant probably now more than ever with the growth and gains in the industry since and after the pandemic.

No, it isn't growing and I'm not sure where you're getting your information from. Anyone here can tell you that it's not growing. Go look at FMIC, Marshall, etc... investor information, quarterly reports, relations, and get back to us on this growth around valve tube audio equipment. Anyways, good luck with all of that.

 

[The~Kid]

No, it isn't growing and I'm not sure where you're getting your information from. Anyone here can tell you that it's not growing. Go look at FMIC, Marshall, etc... investor information, quarterly reports, relations, and get back to us on this growth around valve tube audio equipment. Anyways, good luck with all of that.

Unless you've been stuck under a rock these past couple years since and after the pandemic ahem ahem....... it's not getting smaller as said this is an old outdated myth and misconception....... and argument for the Status Quo in the current tube market.....


In any case as said it's pretty lazy and irresponsible that the music industry hasn't or isn't pursuing other alternatives to tubes outside of China/Slovakia/Russia for obvious said reasons that they should......


We can see the Pandemic brought a huge surge in the industry and injected more money and youth into it as well and new money and young blood...... contrary to conventional wisdom and old outdated internet myths the industry is growing more than ever before and electric guitar is at the heart of that growth amongst guitar in general......

https://www.pianodreamers.com/guitar-sales-statistics/


"Global guitar sales reached $17.2 billion in 2020, an increase of 9.5% from 2019.
The US was responsible for $4.4 billion of this total, an increase of 10.7% from the previous year.

This growth is expected to continue in the coming years, with the global guitar market projected to reach $19.9 billion by 2025.
In the US, electric guitars make up the largest share of the market, accounting for 58% of all sales.

Acoustic guitars are the second most popular type of guitar, accounting for 36% of sales."

 

[The~Kid]

IMO aside from the "Make it in Merika" crowd which many of the Fender/Mesa/Big Boutique amp manufactures are a part of.....

I mean where the hell are they on the matter and yeah pretty lazy and irresponsible to simply use old outdated myths and excuses to keep the Status Quo of making garbage tubes in Slovakia or the use of Chinese/Russian tubes as the only real options in the market and if we cant make them here in America why not Mexico, India, Vietnam, Indonesia etc etc

 

[NowYou'rePlayingWithPower]

Unless you've been stuck under a rock these past couple years since and after the pandemic ahem ahem....... it's not getting smaller as said this is an old outdated myth and misconception....... and argument for the Status Quo in the current tube market.....


In any case as said it's pretty lazy and irresponsible that the music industry hasn't or isn't pursuing other alternatives to tubes outside of China/Slovakia/Russia for obvious said reasons that they should......


We can see the Pandemic brought a huge surge in the industry and injected more money and youth into it as well and new money and young blood...... contrary to conventional wisdom and old outdated internet myths the industry is growing more than ever before and electric guitar is at the heart of that growth amongst guitar in general......



View attachment 401228

https://www.pianodreamers.com/guitar-sales-statistics/


"Global guitar sales reached $17.2 billion in 2020, an increase of 9.5% from 2019.
The US was responsible for $4.4 billion of this total, an increase of 10.7% from the previous year.

This growth is expected to continue in the coming years, with the global guitar market projected to reach $19.9 billion by 2025.
In the US, electric guitars make up the largest share of the market, accounting for 58% of all sales.

Acoustic guitars are the second most popular type of guitar, accounting for 36% of sales."

Did you even read that link?
It was written in 2022 and the numbers were projections.
Terrible ones at that.
Try actual investor relations info.
Please do not give other people investment advice.

 

[The~Kid]

Did you even read that link?
It was written in 2022 and the numbers were projections.
Terrible ones at that.
Try actual investor relations info.
Please do not give other people investment advice.

It's not just 2022 numbers but 2023 numbers showed the same growth and projections...... and the pace remains the same regarding growth from the latest numbers available...... Despite tariffs or other nonsense too......

Contrary to outdated internet myths or conventional wisdom...... the industry is actually growing and it's never been bigger and regardless in 2025 it's time the music industry does the responsible thing and find and secure sources of tubes outside of China/Slovakia/Russia...... not doing so is simply irresponsible and lazy on the part of the industry as a whole.


More and more of the market is female with 49% of new players being female and another trend. I think by now in 2025 it's probably at 50/50 too and that is a big part of the growth aside from young blood, new money and population growth in itself.


Since 2020, guitar sales have continued to grow at a similar rate. Sales have increased by 14% in 2023, reaching a grand total of $1.8 billion in total. This is slightly lower than 2020’s 15%, but the change is negligible within such a small time frame.

https://musicstrive.blog/guitar-sales-statistics/

 

[NowYou'rePlayingWithPower]

It's not just 2022 numbers but 2023 numbers showed the same growth and projections...... and the pace remains the same regarding growth from the latest numbers available...... Despite tariffs or other nonsense too......

Contrary to outdated internet myths or conventional wisdom...... the industry is actually growing and it's never been bigger and regardless in 2025 it's time the music industry does the responsible thing and find and secure sources of tubes outside of China/Slovakia/Russia...... not doing so is simply irresponsible and lazy on the part of the industry as a whole.


More and more of the market is female with 49% of new players being female and another trend. I think by now in 2025 it's probably at 50/50 too and that is a big part of the growth aside from young blood, new money and population growth in itself.


Since 2020, guitar sales have continued to grow at a similar rate. Sales have increased by 14% in 2023, reaching a grand total of $1.8 billion in total. This is slightly lower than 2020’s 15%, but the change is negligible within such a small time frame.

https://musicstrive.blog/guitar-sales-statistics/

Nonsense. Wishing for something doesn't make it a reality.
Not one thing in any of the Chatbot articles you've linked shows a source to backup your claims.
Try the actual companies investor data and get back to us. Better yet ask anyone here how their sales have been since the covid peak.

 

[The~Kid]

Nonsense. Wishing for something doesn't make it a reality.
Not one thing in any of the Chatbot articles you've linked shows a source to backup your claims.
Try the actual companies investor data and get back to us. Better yet ask anyone here how their sales have been since the covid peak.

Yeah I guess kicking the can down the road and continuing to do the unsustainable thing relying on Chinese/Russian/Slovakian tubes is the only option then....... lets just sit back and let the music industry continue to do the irresponsible and lazy thing until its too late and some war breaks out or some other fire happens in a Chinese factory or whatever else that may happen that disrupts the alreasy fragile and volatile supply of tubes

 

[NowYou'rePlayingWithPower]

Yeah I guess kicking the can down the road and continuing to do the unsustainable thing relying on Chinese/Russian/Slovakian tubes is the only option then....... lets just sit back and let the music industry continue to do the irresponsible and lazy thing until its too late and some war breaks out or some other fire happens in a Chinese factory or whatever else that may happen that disrupts the alreasy fragile and volatile supply of tubes

Nobody in the big picture cares about guitar amp valve tubes. They aren't going to lose millions of dollars to feed a niche to make a handful of people happy. Somehow I doubt that when WWIII breaks out anybody with money is going to be kicking themselves for not investing. Hopes and dreams don't make reality.