Bad luck with JJ ecc83s

[Dino 939]

Dude.. I had some sketchy ones also from a big order from Eurotubes.
They didn’t sound or vibe well either.

I call JJ pre’s: “lToad Boner’s”.
Annoying little f’n ribbett’s..
What I learned bro’ with JJ pre’s is
the HG,those high gain one’s will always be best, no matter the boner.
The Middies & SG, standard gain , we’re very weak in detail and not good with high gain noise.
The HG’s sometimes were too freakin’ much boner..f’n full frontal tea baggin’ it bro’.
But they were definately quieter then the other’s
Example:
The HG’s were quieter in my JVM 410 H then the other toad boner offerings and actually had better cleans etc.
The vibe to the top-end was crunchier also.
We’re talkin’ frog’s hair tonal opinion here as it’s about more then just a toad boner in your signal.
Speaker’s are the vagina in the mix..speaker wires....ovarian tubes..F’n Kurdt’..
”Steaming silver begins to melt”..

Anyways, I get it.
I did think the 5751 was decent for the JVM 410H.
In front or back of the pre-amp.
The best El-34 is the stock Reggie model
You’re asking for trouble with the other offerings
So go easy with the L’s!!
Those fucker’s will burn for your damn amp up
or likely damn well near did..installing & biasing them up..that’s where you gotta put the eye of the tiger on the situation, installng the EL-34L’s.
Awesome bottom end punch in the grunt tho’..
And super good in the Mesa Stilletto Ace

 

[BABMusic]

I mean if these things cost a pretty penny...... why ship them out with shitty or below average tubes by most opinion. JJ preamps are simply the worst IME and maybe it's fine for Jazz players on average...... or not sure who needs a super dark, muddy tone

I tried using EH 12ax7 in my Mark series amp and it sounded really shrill and bright. I couldn't dial it out. Once I put JJ tubes in, it sounded normal again. Some brands just work better with specific amps. I put Tung Sol's in my Friedman and didn't like it compared other options. Just have to see what works.

 

[The~Kid]

I tried using EH 12ax7 in my Mark series amp and it sounded really shrill and bright. I couldn't dial it out. Once I put JJ tubes in, it sounded normal again. Some brands just work better with specific amps. I put Tung Sol's in my Friedman and didn't like it compared other options. Just have to see what works.

Right on....... but on average most seem to agree JJ preamps just are meh at best is all I'm saying......


And with Shuguangs back and all the other options like LPS or other Sovtek options from EHX, TungSol, Mullard or Chinese options from Lin Lai, Shuguang, Psvane etc etc available and steady supply even after the Ukraine war.......


Why continue to use JJ? When on average many prefer other preamps over JJs on average....... it's not even a cost thing and it just seems like something that was done when the war initially broke out and it's not really necessary to use JJs for preamps anymore in that sense



Shuguang plant and not using the Chinese ones was due to the plant shutting down..... now it's back.....


So why use JJ preamps still from the factory on top dollar boutique amps..... it makes very little sense IMO.


Fender for example switched to JJs for preamps and power section on their Reissues...... the amps sound like garbage now IMO.

 

[The~Kid]

I do believe the world needs alternatives to just JJ, Sovtek and Shuguangs or tubes from just three countries......


But until then I ain't buying JJs to virtue signal or for whatever other reason other than based on the fact that they are pretty meh on average...... maybe JJ should make better tubes......


Maybe we should have a Tube plant open up in Guatemala or Mexico or India or hell Fort Wayne Indiana in the US....... that makes as good or better tubes than other current production but until then it's hard to beat the Chinese/Russian tubes and I tried playing and using JJs but they just dont sound good IME in anything.

 

[matttornado]

Maybe the box of tubes used for that production run was dropped by accident and the tubes developed cracks? Might not be JJ's fault.

 

[BABMusic]

@The-Kid, You know, I now wonder if the batch of EH tubes I bought were defective. I don't know if it's normal for EH 12ax7 tubes to sound really bright and shrill.

 

[The~Kid]

@The-Kid, You know, I now wonder if the batch of EH tubes I bought were defective. I don't know if it's normal for EH 12ax7 tubes to sound really bright and shrill.

Yeah they shouldn't be shrill or bright. Try another from Viva Tubes.

Usually IMO across the board they are pretty well balanced across the spectrum Probably the most balanced tube I've tried or in production. Not my fave but not half bad either but yeah YMMV.

 

[The~Kid]

@BABMusic specifically what 12AX7 derivative from EH was it?

 

[BABMusic]

@BABMusic specifically what 12AX7 derivative from EH was it?

It was just the standard 12ax7 or Ecc83. I bought them from a reseller, maybe Tube Depot or Doug's.

 

[The~Kid]

It was just the standard 12ax7 or Ecc83. I bought them from a reseller, maybe Tube Depot or Doug's.

What are you comparing to?

 

[The~Kid]

If your comparing to say Tungsol RI, JJ or a Mullard RI for example it may seem brighter. I'd be surprised if Dougs Tubes or Tube Depot would send bunk tubes in that sense and sometimes it's relative.

 

[The~Kid]

@BABMusic If you feel the EH 12ax7 is too bright I would consider the Mullard RI or Tungsol or Sovtek 5751.

 

[glpg80]

I’ve had one break like that before but it was a sovtek recently made during covid. I haven’t had it happen since but it was weird. Amp got quiet and I went to pull the tubes and noticed one of the darn things had exploded in the amp socket. I had to use a pair of pliers to get the base pulled out of the socket. Seems like inferior quality.

 

[The~Kid]

I’ve had one break like that before but it was a sovtek recently made during covid. I haven’t had it happen since but it was weird. Amp got quiet and I went to pull the tubes and noticed one of the darn things had exploded in the amp socket. I had to use a pair of pliers to get the base pulled out of the socket. Seems like inferior quality.

Yeah pretty inferior quality never had a tube go out like that from Russian or Chinese builds.


OP just had two do the same thing back to back from JJs....... so much for superior Slovakian tubes or whatever.

 

[BABMusic]

What are you comparing to?

Mainly JJ 12ax7s, but also some Mesa tubes (no idea who made them for Mesa), and Tung Sol. EH seem to work okay in my BE50, but with slightly less gain than a JJ. Didn't like the Tung Sol in the BE, but they are okay if not used in V1 or V2. I am honest not sure what brands I should check out next.

 

[The~Kid]

Mainly JJ 12ax7s, but also some Mesa tubes (no idea who made them for Mesa), and Tung Sol. EH seem to work okay in my BE50, but with slightly less gain than a JJ. Didn't like the Tung Sol in the BE, but they are okay if not used in V1 or V2. I am honest not sure what brands I should check out next.

The Mesa may be rebrand JJ you can compare and if they are similar they are most likely JJ rebrands. Mesa also used Sovtek and Shuguang rebrands I believe if not Sovtek for sure Shuguang or both as said. But yeah relative to a JJ an EHX is brighter but in general the EHX is a pretty balanced tube IMO.

If it's a Shuguang it will look like the 12AX7B 9th Gen if doesn't look like a 9th Gen then it's probably a Sovtek rebrans.

Tung Sols are kind of dark like a JJ but with cut mids and higher bass response also less highs even nut I like them for the cut mids and usually put them in a V3 spot. IMO what you should consider is a Sovtek LPS and/or a Shuguang 9th Gen if your after higher gain and both will be have more gain and be brighter than an EHX too.

 

[The~Kid]

@BABMusic if you take a Pic of the preamps I may see what the Mesa tubes are possibly too for reference but yeah....



If they are Shuguangs if they have a square getter they are older 8th Gen if they have the round one they are 9th Gen and if it ain't a Shuguang it could be Sovtek or JJ. Right now I believe they use JJ rebrands for current production but older ones were Shuguangs for sure and/or Sovteks.

 

[LPMojoGL]

I usually pull JJ 12ax7s from any amp I'm fond of. I'll use em as a PI, or put em in cheaper amps I'm flipping.
Haven't had any fail on me, but don't dig the way they sound.

 

[The~Kid]

Some tubes can't handle certain positions on certain amps and it may not be the tube that's the issue just the fact that it may not be best suited for V1.......


If that is the case and it persist retty much your going to want a HG+ version of a JJ, 9th Gen or Psvane Dougs Tubes and Rubys Tubes have these on their site and/or Ebay. The Groove Tube at Ruby Tubes is also available in HG+.


Pretty much HG+ tubes are graded to withstand V1 spots where the juice gets introduced into the signal to begin with. Some amps it may not really matter but for others you may need something bit more robust and that's where the HG+ comes in.


Other tubes like the LPS, EHX or TungSol 12AX7 have thicker glass pretty much encasing all the filaments so they can usually handle V1 no problem too and no real need to grade them as they can handle the power and juice no problem. I hear there are issues with them in cathode based amps in V2 however but never had such issues but still moved them to V1 or V2 out of consideration to the rising cost and uncertain supply issues of some tubes in these times.


Honestly a lot of the Preamp matching really isn't kind of needed IMO and sort of redundant I figure when it comes to a point and matched Power Tubes make more sense IMO. Recently ordered some HG version of tubes but that's mainly only because they were the only ones available of that brand.


But some places do go the extra step and sort of match your tubes or grade them or whatever the hell without extra charge like Viva Tubes and I usually get my preamps from there when I can just because they do that without adding extra cost really and the prices overall are pretty competitive.

 

[The~Kid]

I usually pull JJ 12ax7s from any amp I'm fond of. I'll use em as a PI, or put em in cheaper amps I'm flipping.
Haven't had any fail on me, but don't dig the way they sound.

Same here. I remember when I was a kid going to get some at Sam Ash because everyone always raved about them.

I had like a Peavey Classic 30. So I go get like 2 or 3 of them and yeah...... so terrible and just never used them again. Thankfully was able to land a couple GE12AX7 with white lettering and I had an opportunity to check out one of the best tubes made.


IMO the Sovtek LPS and Mullard 12AX7 Long Plate are like the closest to that sound with the Sovtek being a more hi fi and higher gain version with fast tracking and the Mullard being a more vintage version medium gain version and more sag.

Kind of want to try the JJ Hi Performance Long Plate version and will probably see what's up. I think they say it's got more cut mids relative to the regular one and tighter bass response and they seem to say it's brighter given that it "improved details" as the regular ones are muddy as hell.



May give them a shot one of these days and see what's up but regarding everything else JJ...... I mean I have power tubes but just as back ups in case the Tung Sols crap out but yeah......