Best Multi FX Hardware

[tallcoolone]

More limited how? I'm not talking about creating complex soundscapes here. I'm talking about high-quality effects that a guitarist is likely to use - delay, reverb, modulation etc. I don't see EvenTide wining this, at all.

Not sure about ‘winning’ but after using both for years the Eventide delays/reverbs/modulation are def at least on par with the Fractal stuff.

 

[Rackman]

More limited how? I'm not talking about creating complex soundscapes here. I'm talking about high-quality effects that a guitarist is likely to use - delay, reverb, modulation etc. I don't see EvenTide wining this, at all.

That's because you don't understand the respective capabilities of the two sets of software. AxeFX gives you a preset editor. Eventide gives you an effects algorithm editor (as well as a preset editor). Not the same thing.

Say for example I want an algorithmic reverb that has diffusors on some taps and not on others. I can easily do that in Vsig. With the Axe I get what they decide to give me.

 

[Rackman]

Not sure about ‘winning’ but after using both for years the Eventide delays/reverbs/modulation are def at least on par with the Fractal stuff.

I mean I'm not trying to bash AxeFX here - other than the horrible resale value I really see no problem with them and they fit a niche. But Eventide FX have been on everything for decades for a reason - they're awesome.

 

[CoreyW]

Depending on what your end goal is, will shape the appeal of the interface side of the Axe FX. I haven’t looked at the back of my Axe in a while, but I don’t remember there being xlr inputs for Mics.

If you’re just looking to get guitar, bass, and possibly keyboards into a computer, it should work fine, but if you’re wanting to do vocals, you would more than likely find it lacking. As a direct mic > unit > DAW solution, and I don’t know any that have phantom power.

Personally I run my Axe into my interface.

Most of the “modern” modelers are able to be used in this way, even down to the Pod Go.

 

[SonVolt]

That's because you don't understand the respective capabilities of the two sets of software. AxeFX gives you a preset editor. Eventide gives you an effects algorithm editor (as well as a preset editor). Not the same thing.

Say for example I want an algorithmic reverb that has diffusors on some taps and not on others. I can easily do that in Vsig. With the Axe I get what they decide to give me.

So where does one even buy an Eclipse? I can't seem to find any retailer that sells an Eclipse. I was able to get an Axe 3 in my shopping cart pretty quick.

 

[CoreyW]

I mean I'm not trying to bash AxeFX here - other than the horrible resale value I really see no problem with them and they fit a niche. But Eventide FX have been on everything for decades for a reason - they're awesome.

Horrible resale value?

1st Gen Axe FX units are still moving.

FM3 and 9 sell for $100 less than new.

Historically when the new unit comes out, the newly outdated generation doesn’t loose much value at all considering when an Axe Fx4 drops it will be at least a year before the wait list is gone.

 

[stratjacket]

I think for effects quality, AxeFx and Eventide are both great, on par. As mentioned, I use both the H90 and AxeFx in my chain. I don’t think one is Best across the board, just depends on what you want to do.

I think if you wanted to go H9000 (for about $7k) the main advantage I see is the ability to create sound design. I would never need that. AxeFx is made for guitarists and how we use traditional pedals and rack effects. You can edit til your hearts content if you want as well or just add a delay and go.

If I had nothing and money was no object I’d buy the AxeFx. If budget was a concern I’d go with the H90 or Fractal VP4. Can’t go wrong with any of them.

Edit to say, I’d choose the H90 over the Eclipse. Mainly due to price and editing. H90 cheaper and you can edit pretty easily right in the unit. The H90 edit software is very easy if you like that route too. I didn’t think the Eclipse had editing software and the little panel is cumbersome to me.

 

[Shask]

Much better user experience.... better interface... infinitely better software editor. Better company support.... better community support (which is huge). EvenTide is awesome stuff, but again - for a guitar player - I can't imagine many people picking an Eclipse over an Axe Fx 3 if they were given an equal amount of time with either.

Having the editor with the ability to have the Block Library is so useful. I have older rack units like the MPX1 and G Major 2, and when I use them I really miss having a PC editor for editing, saving sounds, and the block library.

I have an older Axe II and FM3, but I think the VP4 would be a good choice. I keep thinking about one.

 

[Rackman]

Horrible resale value?

1st Gen Axe FX units are still moving.

FM3 and 9 sell for $100 less than new.

Historically when the new unit comes out, the newly outdated generation doesn’t loose much value at all considering when an Axe Fx4 drops it will be at least a year before the wait list is gone.

Axe IIs tend to be about $500-600. Given what they were new, that's a pretty bad beating to take given they were over $2K new if I remember right.

Bought used, AxeFX is a much better deal.

 

[Rackman]

So where does one even buy an Eclipse? I can't seem to find any retailer that sells an Eclipse.

That's because it's no longer in production. The current product is the H9000. We'll see if they release another 1U but I bought a pair of Eclipses used in the $1000 - $1200 range (don't remember exactly). I'm well aware of Fractal and would have bought that instead if it did what I wanted, which it doesn't.

 

[CoreyW]

Axe IIs tend to be about $500-600. Given what they were new, that's a pretty bad beating to take given they were over $2K new if I remember right.

Bought used, AxeFX is a much better deal.

And what are the first generations of the other modeling units selling for? Are they even selling?

Let’s not kid ourselves, $500-600 bucks for a first Gen modeling system that has been upgraded and rereleased is pretty insane. 20 year old digital tech that has any resale is pretty damn good.

The eventide is not a guitar targeted modeler, it is a studio processor, that some people have adapted for guitar effects.

The eventide eclipe came out in what 2002? $3,000 new price? One on Reverb right now for 800. That a worse resale than a Gen 1 Axe FX at $600.

 

[Anje]

I'm still loving my old H3000 (upgraded to H3500) and PCM81, as far as "multi FX" hardware units.
The H3000 is to me one of the very best & few HW units that is able to combine a particular "sound" signature/character AND pretty good complex algo capability, especially with the "mod factory" introduced in the later versions (precursor to the Vsig found in the newer units that Rackman described).

 

[CoreyW]

Do u agree with this?

Source: YouTube https://share.google/hDmnpWyXu1F2B8Bgw

Regarding his "cons" he was pretty over dramatic about the front panel. If you cant figure it out in a few minutes, then its more a you issue rather than the unit issue. Just for example, when I page to the master list of presets, I hit the enter button and mine takes me to that preset page, and instead using the IR block for the example of an block edit is being pretty dishonest.

Here is the amp edit page on the FM3….

If you cant figure out how to use that....

 

[Rackman]

And what are the first generations of the other modeling units selling for? Are they even selling?

Let’s not kid ourselves, $500-600 bucks for a first Gen modeling system that has been upgraded and rereleased is pretty insane. 20 year old digital tech that has any resale is pretty damn good.

The eventide is not a guitar targeted modeler, it is a studio processor, that some people have adapted for guitar effects.

The eventide eclipe came out in what 2002? $3,000 new price? One on Reverb right now for 800. That a worse resale than a Gen 1 Axe FX at $600.

Eventide eclipses new were $1995 and are $1200 or so now in nice condition. That one on Reverb is trashed which is why it's sitting there at $800. Axe FX IIs were $2200 and now are $550 in nice condition.

There's a big difference between something selling at 60% of new price used, which is pretty typical, and something selling at 25%. But that's the buyer's business. AxeFX historically have been an awesome used purchase a gen back but horrible new.

 

[journeyman73]

the reality is, those that advocate for Eventide suffer from a couple implicit assumptions that bias their recommendations: that a player wants/needs to significantly modify/create effects AND/OR that a player is willing/able to deal with vsig.

if either one of those is false (and for MOST, NOT ALL GUITAR PLAYERS) one or both of those assumptions is not true.

so, for example if you are just comparing presets (with very slight menu modifications, not going down the rabbit hole of lfos, decays, etc) and ease of setting up virtual chains and racks - there is NO comparison of what unit is FAR simoler to use, If someone likes the Eventide prests so much better that they are willing to sacrifice the ease of building chains/racks that’s cool - but that would be the ONLY reason one would choose an Eventide (on the merits) if the above two assumptions are not true.

 

[Rackman]

the reality is, those that advocate for Eventide suffer from a couple implicit assumptions that bias their recommendations: that a player wants/needs to significantly modify/create effects AND/OR that a player is willing/able to deal with vsig.

Everyone's welcome to decide how important it is to them to get the FX to do what they want and how much effort they want to put into understanding synthesis to make that happen. If the answer is "it's not very important" then there's plenty of products that cater to that level of engagement.

For people who do care, there are products that cater to what they want.

Get what fits your level of interest and effort.

 

[SonVolt]

Glad we can all agree that the Axe-Fx III is still the best multi-fx unit on the market.

 

[Shask]

Eventide eclipses new were $1995 and are $1200 or so now in nice condition. That one on Reverb is trashed which is why it's sitting there at $800. Axe FX IIs were $220 and now are $550 in nice condition.

There's a big difference between something selling at 60% of new price used, which is pretty typical, and something selling at 25%. But that's the buyer's business. AxeFX historically have been an awesome used purchase a gen back but horrible new.

That is probably because the Axe III came out after the Axe II and can do the same everything and more.

The Eclipse was the last of that series. If they made an Eclipse II that did the same and more, the original Eclipse probably would have dropped the same.

 

[CoreyW]

Eventide eclipses new were $1995 and are $1200 or so now in nice condition. That one on Reverb is trashed which is why it's sitting there at $800. Axe FX IIs were $220 and now are $550 in nice condition.

There's a big difference between something selling at 60% of new price used, which is pretty typical, and something selling at 25%. But that's the buyer's business. AxeFX historically have been an awesome used purchase a gen back but horrible new.

My quick google search shows the Eclipse retailing at 2995 in 2002 when it was released. And others in the sold listings under 1 grand that are not scratched up.

Regardless of initial price point, the eventide rack units are not guitar processors, they can add effects to a signal, but you cant plug a guitar in and have a complete rig in a box.

The H9, while more targeted to instruments suffers from no analog dry through, would it be safe to assume that its big brothers share the same fault?, its little brothers did. If you already running a digital rig, this isnt really an issue, if you're not, it can be depending on what surrounds it.

Personally I moved away from the H9 towards Strymons, and the 500 series Boss units. I found the latter a lot easier to set up and use, but the editor for the H9 was really cool.

 

[Exo-metal]

Which model H3000 first allowed a connection to a computer for editing?