Did anyone just see that Obama speech?

[ttosh]

So its your opinion that Obama's idea of what Govt is would not be called Marxist? Your either to young to understand or know nothing about what Marx's idealogical underpinnings are other than looking up a internet definition. Again its just my opinion but I would suggest that you listen carefully to what Obama says about privately held companies and their earnings for starters. Then you might want to listen carefully to his thoughts on education. Then read Marx's thoughts on the very same things. Tell me what you find different if anything.

I'd be interested to hear what you find similar. Just curious.

Would it not be easier to show some basic differences or any differences as he asked. Why pose a question to a question?

 

[cloudnine]

I know I am a bit late chiming in here, but I just listened to 2 of Obama's speaches. All I can say if he is elected welcome to Marxist America.

Marxism: A political doctrine where the proletariat have to rise up in a violent revolution to get class equality, achieved by eliminating capitalism.

Yep, Obama's a Marxist.

This is no less misleading and WRONG than those dummies who call Bush a facist.

So its your opinion that Obama's idea of what Govt is would not be called Marxist? Your either to young to understand or know nothing about what Marx's idealogical underpinnings are other than looking up a internet definition. Again its just my opinion but I would suggest that you listen carefully to what Obama says about privately held companies and their earnings for starters. Then you might want to listen carefully to his thoughts on education. Then read Marx's thoughts on the very same things. Tell me what you find different if anything.

And do you enjoy any of the gaffe's that Pelosi, Clinton, Boxer, Kennedy, Gore, Carter to only name a few, have made. One could easily claim they are stupid also but the media does not play them up. It only plays up ones from Bush to diminish and purposely incite disapproval of him as president. Errors are errors and any one who publicly speaks as much as any politician does will make some. It think how the left finds only errors with Bush speeches, word usage says more about how intellectually dishonest they are and not the other way around. I think its more important to listen to what it is they are speaking about rather than some small error in speaking or wording. I think content is more important.

I enjoy gaffes from everybody, Obama included. The 57 states thing is funny, especially since he keeps running with it even after the laughter.

I especially like this one.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3044/252 ... 24.jpg?v=0

I have read the Communist Manifesto, and I know what Marxism is. If you did, you would not call Obama's election the advent of Marxism because you would be a fool. Marxism is a violent overthrow of government. Where does Obama call for a violent overthrow of government? Where does he advocate for the elimination of capitalism?

I would also like to hear how Marxist theory resembles Obama's in any way - the burden of proof is on you to present it since you brought it up.

 

[verderacer]

So its your opinion that Obama's idea of what Govt is would not be called Marxist? Your either to young to understand or know nothing about what Marx's idealogical underpinnings are other than looking up a internet definition. Again its just my opinion but I would suggest that you listen carefully to what Obama says about privately held companies and their earnings for starters. Then you might want to listen carefully to his thoughts on education. Then read Marx's thoughts on the very same things. Tell me what you find different if anything.

I'd be interested to hear what you find similar. Just curious.

What I find or what I have already read and know from Marx's own words? But then that would be avoiding the question and it was prosed so others would read about Marx and his ideology. Try doing the work yourself rather than throw the question back, it's far more rewarding.

 

[Phishphood]

I know I am a bit late chiming in here, but I just listened to 2 of Obama's speaches. All I can say if he is elected welcome to Marxist America.

Marxism: A political doctrine where the proletariat have to rise up in a violent revolution to get class equality, achieved by eliminating capitalism.

Yep, Obama's a Marxist.

This is no less misleading and WRONG than those dummies who call Bush a facist.

So its your opinion that Obama's idea of what Govt is would not be called Marxist? Your either to young to understand or know nothing about what Marx's idealogical underpinnings are other than looking up a internet definition. Again its just my opinion but I would suggest that you listen carefully to what Obama says about privately held companies and their earnings for starters. Then you might want to listen carefully to his thoughts on education. Then read Marx's thoughts on the very same things. Tell me what you find different if anything.

I've tried to stay out of this but I have to say something here. Calling Obama Marxist is simply ridiculous. You can't attempt to overthrow the bourgeoisie by giving them tax breaks, its totally contrary to the entire purpose of the Communist Manifesto. And education? Obama supports charter schools, which are essentially privatization of the public school system, how is that Marxist? Lastly, I'm not sure what comments about privately held companies you're referring to but I'm just going to say that not putting all your faith in unregulated capitalism doesn't make you socialist, much less Marxist, its simply being realistic. That's such a ludicrous oversimplification I'm amazed at how common it is in political discussions. Its like we're going back to McCarthyism

 

[Chubtone]

Its like we're going back to McCarthyism

Sweet! She was HOT!

 

[ttosh]

I called my statement evidence where? Hello? I said "I bet". And I do bet you that. I'm not the one who earlier in this thread tried to puff himself up and impress us by talking about how he was studying "statistical analysis" and needed to confirm sources. Been there buddy. Did that. So I have the same collegiate experiences you have had, yet fully completed. I also have a couple of decades of experience post college in what my "jerk" parents called the real world. Guess what? That stuff your studying is almost completely worthless. But go ahead, puff yourself up like a frog and intimidate us with your overwhelming intellect. Those of us that have been where you are are laughing at you. It's like a cute little flashback.

I don't care if your impressed, that wasn't my intention. don't read into it. I couldn't care less whether your impressed or not by what I do or what I do not do. When I said that I was trying to say I was in the middle of studying and would have time to go over some things later. I guess you misinterpreted that, honest mistake, could have been worded better.

What collegiate experiences do I have O wise one? What same experiences do we, kindred spirits I'm sure, share?

Who says I don't live in the real world? You know NOTHING about me, my job, my lifestyle, my studying, me thoughts, feelings or beleifs. But hey, I guess you can TOTALLY judge me since you live in this "real world" - and that gives you some kind of masterful insight in a person you've never met, never had a conversation with, and don't even know the name of.

Your not adding to any kind of debate by being patronizing, and yes, I do see the irony there.

Seems like based on most of your posts you have tried to impress and patronize, just my opinion. He (chubtone) spoke of the real world, but did not say you did not live there in the quote you posted. The overall comments are not based on your job, lifestyle, studying, thoughts except where and what you have posted on this thread. Outside of the posts you and others have made that we (being quite a few of us) disagree with, there is a possibility we all could agree and see eye to eye on other topics. However like many issues there are core beliefs and we do not see eye to eye.

Outside of Obama and McCain the democratic and republican parties have different goals to achieve a good economy, more jobs, healthcare, etc.... Obama and McCain are the two candidates and I personally have decided that I like living in a capitalistic country and we have already started moving away from it IMHO.

Obama is not a candidate I would vote for, I have posted why several times and I am tired of doing so as the sensible posts throughout have been disregarded for just more patronizing overall. I am sure there are plenty of things in this post to shove back at me, hopefully I spelled everything correctly for those of you so concerned with that

 

[cloudnine]

What I find or what I have already read and know from Marx's own words? But then that would be avoiding the question and it was prosed so others would read about Marx and his ideology. Try doing the work yourself rather than throw the question back, it's far more rewarding.

This is what you said, but this is what you mean.

What's up everybody, I'm talking out of my ass and desperately hoping to deflect any inquiries into my ridiculous assertions.

 

[Phishphood]

 

[ttosh]

What I find or what I have already read and know from Marx's own words? But then that would be avoiding the question and it was prosed so others would read about Marx and his ideology. Try doing the work yourself rather than throw the question back, it's far more rewarding.

This is what you said, but this is what you mean.

What's up everybody, I'm talking out of my ass and desperately hoping to deflect any inquiries into my ridiculous assertions.

Once again you add nothing to what could be a good overall conversation about our (not your) country.

 

[cloudnine]

What I find or what I have already read and know from Marx's own words? But then that would be avoiding the question and it was prosed so others would read about Marx and his ideology. Try doing the work yourself rather than throw the question back, it's far more rewarding.

This is what you said, but this is what you mean.

What's up everybody, I'm talking out of my ass and desperately hoping to deflect any inquiries into my ridiculous assertions.

Once again you add nothing to what could be a good overall conversation about our (not your) country.

But it's totally cool to have ad hominem attacks about me all over this fucking thread, right?

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

Seems like based on most of your posts you have tried to impress and patronize, just my opinion.

Patronise certainly, impress hardly.

He (chubtone) spoke of the real world, but did not say you did not live there in the quote you posted. The overall comments are not based on your job, lifestyle, studying, thoughts except where and what you have posted on this thread. Outside of the posts you and others have made that we (being quite a few of us) disagree with, there is a possibility we all could agree and see eye to eye on other topics. However like many issues there are core beliefs and we do not see eye to eye.

He was implying (at least how I read his words) that he was a part of the real world, and because I study, or hold certain views, that means I'm excluded from the "real world" which didn't make much sense to me. We probably could see eye to eye on a lot of things, most of the time it's not the issue people agree on, but the methods to acheive the goal.

Outside of Obama and McCain the democratic and republican parties have different goals to achieve a good economy, more jobs, healthcare, etc.... Obama and McCain are the two candidates and I personally have decided that I like living in a capitalistic country and we have already started moving away from it IMHO.

People keep saying this, but I haven't seen any evidence showing this? Are you getting consumerism and capitalism mixed up, or are you talking about something I'm not familiar with? Either was some citation, quotage or antecdote wouldn't be unhelpful.

[quote[Obama is not a candidate I would vote for, I have posted why several times and I am tired of doing so as the sensible posts throughout have been disregarded for just more patronizing overall. I am sure there are plenty of things in this post to shove back at me, hopefully I spelled everything correctly for those of you so concerned with that [/quote]

Grammar Nazis are totally overatted. It's your opinion on whom to vote for, and why or why not. I just get annoyed when people either follow flawed (in my view) logic, or falsehoods. I can't recall whether I thought you were or not, and I'm not going to trall through a few hundred posts to check.

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

But it's totally cool to have ad hominem attacks about me all over this fucking thread, right?

No dude, it's ok. Because we aren't living in America and we are unpatriotic they can say what they want about us, and make unmitigated claims about _EVERYTHING_ and it's cool.

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

I'd be interested to hear what you find similar. Just curious.

What I find or what I have already read and know from Marx's own words? But then that would be avoiding the question and it was prosed so others would read about Marx and his ideology. Try doing the work yourself rather than throw the question back, it's far more rewarding.[/quote]

You made a claim, and haven't backed it up. I haven't said I agree or disagree. But your making it nearly impossible to follow your reasoning.........

If you make an argument or claim the emphasis is on you to provide evidence first and foremost.

 

[ttosh]

But it's totally cool to have ad hominem attacks about me all over this fucking thread, right?

No dude, it's ok. Because we aren't living in America and we are unpatriotic they can say what they want about us, and make unmitigated claims about _EVERYTHING_ and it's cool.

Did somebody say you were unpatriotic? I did not see that but I have not said it. Why would you be patriotic for America? You do not live here, you have not fought to my knowledge for our country? You both talk as if you know what we need, which i find more humorous than anything.

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

Did somebody say you were unpatriotic? I did not see that but I have not said it. Why would you be patriotic for America? You do not live here, you have not fought to my knowledge for our country? You both talk as if you know what we need, which i find more humorous than anything.

No one has, but it's obvious neither cloudnine nor I are. I can't speak for him, but my family is American and I'm a citizen. I give my opinion, nothing more - of course I have thoughts about what you need. I have a similar train of thought for a lot of countries, including my own.

If it's entertaining thats fine.

 

[Chubtone]

Who says I don't live in the real world? You know NOTHING about me, my job, my lifestyle, my studying, me thoughts, feelings or beleifs. But hey, I guess you can TOTALLY judge me since you live in this "real world" - and that gives you some kind of masterful insight in a person you've never met, never had a conversation with, and don't even know the name of.

See, that's exactly what I knew you would write. That's exactly what 20 years younger Chubtone said 20 years ago. This is like some weird flashback where I'm seeing my life fllashing before my eyes.

Just kidding man. I am going to bow out of this thread now. I don't do political threads and I haven't even commented on politics in this. I was just drawn in by Julians incessant whining, the typical and predictable American bashing, and the homeless statistics that were, well quite amusing.

So all..... have fun. Carry on and I will see you on other threads where we discuss important stuff like which 80's shredder had the coolest hair.

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

Well thats no fun .

All 80's shredders had shit hair anyway. Oh Yngwie's wasn't THAT bad, much better than Paul Gilbert's.

 

[ttosh]

Well thats no fun .

All 80's shredders had shit hair anyway. Oh Yngwie's wasn't THAT bad, much better than Paul Gilbert's.

Yngwie had awesome hair, especially in the one picture or cover with the Baby blue strat.

 

[duesentrieb]

liberalism is a mental disorder

When I was young all musicians were left.

Forever young, I wanna be forever young . . .

 

[kool98769]

The whole idea of politics is a load of bollocks.
We're shafted either way...I haven't met a politician who wouldn't sell his soul for a dollar.

Although one of my best friends will probably end up as a politician in like 20 years...
but we'll see what time does to him...


They say that we gotta vote for the lesser of the evils.
We did that for the past 8 years, and look where it got us.
I dont give a sh*t what we do to be honest, but one thing is for sure. the iraq war NEEDS to go. As much as clinton is bashed, he wasn't considered that bad until he got his dick sucked. And IMHO, He's way more of a president than either of the Bush hicks were.
Hearing George Bush speak reminds me of a t-shirt i saw: "I want a president who is fluent in atleast 1 language."
So true.