Entry Level Monitors for Home Guitar/Recording

[JDs Couch]

These are both really good advice, as well.

I have a set of Sennheiser HD600s, which aren't ridiculously expensive by any standard, and I trust them more than any monitors I've ever heard - and i've worked in some studios with insane nice monitors. You'd be surprised how many professionals mix on cheap headphones or monitors because they know how they reproduce sound.

Also as @stratjacket says, people always completely ignore the room correction part of the equation. It doesn't matter how nice or crappy your monitors are if the room has no treatment or isn't corrected - you're just going to have different problem frequencies and blind spots, and chase your tail in an entirely new way AND be however much poorer.

Yep, when I built out a basement studio in my last house, I had the opportunity to set the dimensions to avoid standing waves (avoid having the same number for any two of LxWxH) and also avoid multiples. Also heavy room treatment with Roxul 703 wrapped in fabric. Worked great.

 

[DanTravis62]

Yep, when I built out a basement studio in my last house, I had the opportunity to set the dimensions to avoid standing waves (avoid having the same number for any two of LxWxH) and also avoid multiples. Also heavy room treatment with Roxul 703 wrapped in fabric. Worked great.

Its crazy that people spend thousands of dollars on their monitors without even beginning to treat their room with ANYTHING

But people do it all the time, and then wonder why their barefoot sound or clarisys monitors didn't magically make their mixes sound "pro" automatically

I've been asked multiple times to check out people's setups where this has happened

and I'm not even exaggerating, yes they spent "down payment on a house" money on monitors without any treatment. Not even BASS TRAPS. NOTHING.

This is why I'm always a little eye-rolly about dudes with amazing studio gear even on RT. None of this shit means anything if you can't use it; and that works for Cameron's and Trainwrecks, and it works triple for monitoring

 

[JDs Couch]

Its crazy that people spend thousands of dollars on their monitors without even beginning to treat their room with ANYTHING

But people do it all the time, and then wonder why their barefoot sound or clarisys monitors didn't magically make their mixes sound "pro" automatically

I've been asked multiple times to check out people's setups where this has happened

and I'm not even exaggerating, yes they spent "down payment on a house" money on monitors without any treatment. Not even BASS TRAPS. NOTHING.

This is why I'm always a little eye-rolly about dudes with amazing studio gear even on RT. None of this shit means anything if you can't use it; and that works for Cameron's and Trainwrecks, and it works triple for monitoring

For sure. I spent a fair bit of time reading on GearSlutz back then and learned a shitload about studio design and build. And built a pretty good sounding jam/tracking room and a good control room. Decent isolation between them and the outside world as well.

 

[Charvel1975]

*Update* Just got a new pair of Edifier MR3's

https://www.edifier.com/us/p/studio-monitors/mr3

 

[Omnipotent1]

These are both really good advice, as well.

I have a set of Sennheiser HD600s, which aren't ridiculously expensive by any standard, and I trust them more than any monitors I've ever heard - and i've worked in some studios with insane nice monitors. You'd be surprised how many professionals mix on cheap headphones or monitors because they know how they reproduce sound.

Also as @stratjacket says, people always completely ignore the room correction part of the equation. It doesn't matter how nice or crappy your monitors are if the room has no treatment or isn't corrected - you're just going to have different problem frequencies and blind spots, and chase your tail in an entirely new way AND be however much poorer.

That part definitely great advice with the headphones, learning the monitors, & room correction. Unfortunately actual room treatment is the most overlooked because nobody wants to invest in it. It doesn’t have to be crazy expensive tho.. If you’re even slightly handy with a drill & stapler some 1x4 or 1x6 pine from the hardware store, rockwool safe n sound or Henry Denim insulation for my hippie homies, & fabric (burlap or anything that passes the breath test) from Joann’s can work wonders. Room treatment will bring the listening environment to life instead of a convoluted canceled out mess. Better off with just headphones at that point. Nice headphones btw! The 600s are solid. Do you find them to have a very flat response like beyerdynamics? I was at Sweetwater checking out the hd800s they’re definitely on my list. Have a pair of dt770s I’ve used for like 15 years now. I trust them for sure.

Budget monitoring list: Yamaha HS, KrK Rokits, or IK Micro monitors would suffice as previously mentioned by others. Beyerdynamics for headphones & you’re off to the races.

Step up would be Adams, or Focals.

If you ever get bit by the bug….. Sennheiser HD800s, & ATC monitors. I rock the ATC SCM45A. ATC’s shine a microscope on the midrange & just let you hear everyyyyyything. In the best way possible. Truly an experience.

Anyways good luck on your venture @Charvel1975

 

[DanTravis62]

That part definitely great advice with the headphones, learning the monitors, & room correction. Unfortunately actual room treatment is the most overlooked because nobody wants to invest in it. It doesn’t have to be crazy expensive tho.. If you’re even slightly handy with a drill & stapler some 1x4 or 1x6 pine from the hardware store, rockwool safe n sound or Henry Denim insulation for my hippie homies, & fabric (burlap or anything that passes the breath test) from Joann’s can work wonders. Room treatment will bring the listening environment to life instead of a convoluted canceled out mess. Better off with just headphones at that point. Nice headphones btw! The 600s are solid. Do you find them to have a very flat response like beyerdynamics? I was at Sweetwater checking out the hd800s they’re definitely on my list. Have a pair of dt770s I’ve used for like 15 years now. I trust them for sure.

Budget monitoring list: Yamaha HS, KrK Rokits, or IK Micro monitors would suffice as previously mentioned by others. Beyerdynamics for headphones & you’re off to the races.

Step up would be Adams, or Focals.

If you ever get bit by the bug….. Sennheiser HD800s, & ATC monitors. I rock the ATC SCM45A. ATC’s shine a microscope on the midrange & just let you hear everyyyyyything. In the best way possible. Truly an experience.

Anyways good luck on your venture @Charvel1975

Yep doesn't need to be expensive, just has to be corrective. Having some decent (even home made) traps and sound treatment is a million times more important than expensive monitors

I absolutely adore the hd600s - they are super robust, sound great, and are easy to get used to frequency wise. They "pop" a bit more than the beyerdynamics, especially in the low mids for stuff like bass and kick, which is why I prefer them, but the beyerdynamics have a really focused top end.

It's kind of a horses for courses thing - I prefer the hd600s because I generally need to hyper focus on the low end to get things sounding how I want

 

[JimAnsell2]

krks suck and not only that, but when you go to resell them, all you're going to get is other entry level musicians wanting them.
I tried to sell mine pair of krk rokit 8s on ebay and fb market, and all i got was every broke ass rapper in town sending me low ball offers while their social media photos were of the person in questions photographed with thousands of dollars of tattoos, jewelry, and fashion accessories on. Kinda makes you want to punch their low ball offers right in the Cartier sunglasses.
on that note, even worse, was trying to sell a keyboard and having nothing but fake ass "pastors" trying to guilt me into selling it cheap because its going to a church. I'd just reply with "take your tax expempt ass to the congregation and beg for another $100, and its yours".

 

[Kagami]

That part definitely great advice with the headphones, learning the monitors, & room correction. Unfortunately actual room treatment is the most overlooked because nobody wants to invest in it. It doesn’t have to be crazy expensive tho.. If you’re even slightly handy with a drill & stapler some 1x4 or 1x6 pine from the hardware store, rockwool safe n sound or Henry Denim insulation for my hippie homies, & fabric (burlap or anything that passes the breath test) from Joann’s can work wonders. Room treatment will bring the listening environment to life instead of a convoluted canceled out mess. Better off with just headphones at that point. Nice headphones btw! The 600s are solid. Do you find them to have a very flat response like beyerdynamics? I was at Sweetwater checking out the hd800s they’re definitely on my list. Have a pair of dt770s I’ve used for like 15 years now. I trust them for sure.

Budget monitoring list: Yamaha HS, KrK Rokits, or IK Micro monitors would suffice as previously mentioned by others. Beyerdynamics for headphones & you’re off to the races.

Step up would be Adams, or Focals.

If you ever get bit by the bug….. Sennheiser HD800s, & ATC monitors. I rock the ATC SCM45A. ATC’s shine a microscope on the midrange & just let you hear everyyyyyything. In the best way possible. Truly an experience.

Anyways good luck on your venture @Charvel1975

Yep doesn't need to be expensive, just has to be corrective. Having some decent (even home made) traps and sound treatment is a million times more important than expensive monitors

I absolutely adore the hd600s - they are super robust, sound great, and are easy to get used to frequency wise. They "pop" a bit more than the beyerdynamics, especially in the low mids for stuff like bass and kick, which is why I prefer them, but the beyerdynamics have a really focused top end.

It's kind of a horses for courses thing - I prefer the hd600s because I generally need to hyper focus on the low end to get things sounding how I want

The DT770 Pro 250-ohm and HD600 are essentially the baseline for 2 different headphone tuning methodologies the diffuse field and loudness diffuse field respectively so you can't really go wrong with either of them to start with. Some people are really sensitive to the 8kHz spike from the diffuse field methodology so don't like Beyerdynamics but that as always depends on your ears. Axel Grell has some videos on youtube about this and it's fairly interesting. I've got got some 2k+ headphones and the HD600 is still my favourite fwiw but I keep them all around for the fact they all sound different but don't get fooled into thinking spending more gives you better sound because it's not really the case. The HD560S is also fairly similarly tuned to the HD600 and is a bit cheaper so a nice option too.

The HS5 also has a spike at 1kHz or so which makes it sound a bit interesting, you can EQ them to be decent though.

 

[DanTravis62]

The DT770 Pro 250-ohm and HD600 are essentially the baseline for 2 different headphone tuning methodologies the diffuse field and loudness diffuse field respectively so you can't really go wrong with either of them to start with. Some people are really sensitive to the 8kHz spike from the diffuse field methodology so don't like Beyerdynamics but that as always depends on your ears. Axel Grell has some videos on youtube about this and it's fairly interesting. I've got got some 2k+ headphones and the HD600 is still my favourite fwiw but I keep them all around for the fact they all sound different but don't get fooled into thinking spending more gives you better sound because it's not really the case. The HD560S is also fairly similarly tuned to the HD600 and is a bit cheaper so a nice option too.

The HS5 also has a spike at 1kHz or so which makes it sound a bit interesting, you can EQ them to be decent though.

That makes a ton of sense as far as why they sound different to me, and also why the high end on the beyerdynamics doesn't sound as "pleasant" to me as the HD600s. (although they are both good)

I too, have tried out many super expensive cans in studios before, and the HD600s just work, man. They have a really pleasant, accurate, natural sound that just works for my recording workflow.

 

[CoreyW]

I recently started treating my room, built 6 2’x4’x2” panels with an Owen’s Corning type insulation panel. 2 on the walls to my left and right and 2 over hear, I have a big window behind my desk but I have a pretty thick curtain over it.

I did some listening before mounting the overheads, and turned off my sonar works, and I couldn’t believe the difference in sound, my Adams T7Vs were sounding unbelievable. I was hearing things in songs I have listened to 1000s of times that I never heard before.

I finally upgraded my Adams to a pair of Kali Audio IN-8s, I’ve only had them for a couple of weeks but I should have them burned in next weekend and I’ll run my room software and see what my room correction eq looks like after, I’m eagerly awaiting the results.

 

[Omnipotent1]

Yep doesn't need to be expensive, just has to be corrective. Having some decent (even home made) traps and sound treatment is a million times more important than expensive monitors

I absolutely adore the hd600s - they are super robust, sound great, and are easy to get used to frequency wise. They "pop" a bit more than the beyerdynamics, especially in the low mids for stuff like bass and kick, which is why I prefer them, but the beyerdynamics have a really focused top end.

It's kind of a horses for courses thing - I prefer the hd600s because I generally need to hyper focus on the low end to get things sounding how I want

The DT770 Pro 250-ohm and HD600 are essentially the baseline for 2 different headphone tuning methodologies the diffuse field and loudness diffuse field respectively so you can't really go wrong with either of them to start with. Some people are really sensitive to the 8kHz spike from the diffuse field methodology so don't like Beyerdynamics but that as always depends on your ears. Axel Grell has some videos on youtube about this and it's fairly interesting. I've got got some 2k+ headphones and the HD600 is still my favourite fwiw but I keep them all around for the fact they all sound different but don't get fooled into thinking spending more gives you better sound because it's not really the case. The HD560S is also fairly similarly tuned to the HD600 and is a bit cheaper so a nice option too.

The HS5 also has a spike at 1kHz or so which makes it sound a bit interesting, you can EQ them to be decent though.

Well @DanTravis62 & @Kagami I didn’t expect to go after a new pair of headphones through offering some monitoring suggestions but you two are a bad influence… As well as my fall guys if the wife says anything I’ve heard the 600s have been slept on for decades now.. I knew the overall consensus was they were always preferred over the 650s. I will add them to my list. I’ve been wanting a pair of open back headphones. The soundstage of the hd800s is what I really really liked but if the hd600 are helping you make confident eq decisions especially in the low end / low mids compared to the dt770 then I’ll give them a go. @Kagami you nerrrrrd joking lol Thanks for the info on the tuning methodologies I always wondered how that was done. Suspected some sort of wizardry. Idk if anyone remembers this site called “inner fidelity” it was ran by a guy named Tyll who went all the way balls deep into the headphone game. Some gold nuggets here:

https://web.archive.org/web/2020052...fidelity.com/content/innerfidelitys-wall-fame

Dig through it sometime. Unfortunately all the frequency response charts don’t load under “resources” anymore but still nostalgic to check out. might help anyone who is on the hunt for headphones as well.

 

[Omnipotent1]

I recently started treating my room, built 6 2’x4’x2” panels with an Owen’s Corning type insulation panel. 2 on the walls to my left and right and 2 over hear, I have a big window behind my desk but I have a pretty thick curtain over it.

I did some listening before mounting the overheads, and turned off my sonar works, and I couldn’t believe the difference in sound, my Adams T7Vs were sounding unbelievable. I was hearing things in songs I have listened to 1000s of times that I never heard before.

I finally upgraded my Adams to a pair of Kali Audio IN-8s, I’ve only had them for a couple of weeks but I should have them burned in next weekend and I’ll run my room software and see what my room correction eq looks like after, I’m eagerly awaiting the results.

I’ve heard some good things about Kali’s!!! Glad you started treating your room & can vouche for its importance in the monitoring world. You’re a good man. Good luck on your build! Owen’s Corning is some tried,true,tested OG shit. learned about that in the studio builders handbook. A lot of great info in there too. Just check out the index:

https://archive.org/details/studiobuildersha0000owsi/mode/1up

 

[DanTravis62]

Well @DanTravis62 & @Kagami I didn’t expect to go after a new pair of headphones through offering some monitoring suggestions but you two are a bad influence… As well as my fall guys if the wife says anything I’ve heard the 600s have been slept on for decades now.. I knew the overall consensus was they were always preferred over the 650s. I will add them to my list. I’ve been wanting a pair of open back headphones. The soundstage of the hd800s is what I really really liked but if the hd600 are helping you make confident eq decisions especially in the low end / low mids compared to the dt770 then I’ll give them a go. @Kagami you nerrrrrd joking lol Thanks for the info on the tuning methodologies I always wondered how that was done. Suspected some sort of wizardry. Idk if anyone remembers this site called “inner fidelity” it was ran by a guy named Tyll who went all the way balls deep into the headphone game. Some gold nuggets here:

https://web.archive.org/web/2020052...fidelity.com/content/innerfidelitys-wall-fame

Dig through it sometime. Unfortunately all the frequency response charts don’t load under “resources” anymore but still nostalgic to check out. might help anyone who is on the hunt for headphones as well.

Man, you won't regret snagging the 600s. I've tried out many more expensive, higher quality, more transparent, better sounding headphones, and I always come back to them.

Whatever wizardry @Kagami was talking about seems to just really jive with the way I see mixes in my head and translating them. They don't lie, but they aren't "transparent" in the modern super high tech sense. They don't have a crapload of bass frequencies, but seem to have "detail" in the low mids that makes up for it.

Especially after getting used to them, and hearing recordings you know well on them, they are just "the standard" to me as far as headphones go

 

[Nigel]

krks suck and not only that, but when you go to resell them, all you're going to get is other entry level musicians wanting them.
I tried to sell mine pair of krk rokit 8s on ebay and fb market, and all i got was every broke ass rapper in town sending me low ball offers while their social media photos were of the person in questions photographed with thousands of dollars of tattoos, jewelry, and fashion accessories on. Kinda makes you want to punch their low ball offers right in the Cartier sunglasses.
on that note, even worse, was trying to sell a keyboard and having nothing but fake ass "pastors" trying to guilt me into selling it cheap because its going to a church. I'd just reply with "take your tax expempt ass to the congregation and beg for another $100, and its yours".

What made KRK sound great initially were Focal components. No more!

Best bang for the buck is a used pair of JBL LSR 305's. I got one for mom from GC in great shape for $100. They sound phenomenal for the money. Next step up is Focal Alpha series. The 80's in particular are extraordinary.

 

[nightlight]

I'd recommend the really small Kali ones, the LP-UNF. They are nearfield monitors, and the bass response is quite good.

 

[DanTravis62]

Here's that Axel Grell video

 

[Omnipotent1]

Man, you won't regret snagging the 600s. I've tried out many more expensive, higher quality, more transparent, better sounding headphones, and I always come back to them.

Whatever wizardry @Kagami was talking about seems to just really jive with the way I see mixes in my head and translating them. They don't lie, but they aren't "transparent" in the modern super high tech sense. They don't have a crapload of bass frequencies, but seem to have "detail" in the low mids that makes up for it.

Especially after getting used to them, and hearing recordings you know well on them, they are just "the standard" to me as far as headphones go

Exactly what I’m looking for, more detailed low mids. The beyerdynamics suffer in this region, even running them through a dedicated headphone amp for more cajones the low mids are just… smeared? Thank you very much for the suggestion! Best Buy has a really killer deal on them right now too.

 

[DanTravis62]

Exactly what I’m looking for, more detailed low mids. The beyerdynamics suffer in this region, even running them through a dedicated headphone amp for more cajones the low mids are just… smeared? Thank you very much for the suggestion! Best Buy has a really killer deal on them right now too.

They don't have a ton of sub bass, but they have a really nice detail to the low mids, which makes them immensely useful to me for using as a reference when mixing - especially heavy guitars in a mix. There's a reason they haven't changed since 1997 and are still one of the best out there.

They aren't "transparent" or "spacious" but they are super neutral and feel really detailed.

They are 300k so they work best with a dedicated headphone amp, but even without, they are just so freaking good - most of the time i don't even run a dedicated headphone amp with them when I reference mixes.

 

[CoreyW]

They don't have a ton of sub bass, but they have a really nice detail to the low mids, which makes them immensely useful to me for using as a reference when mixing - especially heavy guitars in a mix. There's a reason they haven't changed since 1997 and are still one of the best out there.

They aren't "transparent" or "spacious" but they are super neutral and feel really detailed.

They are 300k so they work best with a dedicated headphone amp, but even without, they are just so freaking good - most of the time i don't even run a dedicated headphone amp with them when I reference mixes.

are you primarily mixing on the headphones, or typically using them as a reference?

 

[DanTravis62]

are you primarily mixing on the headphones, or typically using them as a reference?

Reference, although I could easily mix on the 600s if I needed to - they are that neutral, no exaggeration