Gig Report - harsh conditions in the real world.

[IndyWS6]

what surprises me more than anything about this thread is the number of you that play venues where the PA and sound man is provided. It must be a regional thing; here in my little part of the Midwest, if you don't provide your own PA and sound guy, you don't play. A few of the larger places may have a PA (if you can honestly call it that), but it's for DJ and Karaoke nights - not for the bands that play on the weekends.

 

[mchn13]

No issues with the amps low end. VH4 was surgical. It was just that I couldn't turn it up to the sweet spot. Talk attenuators for live to me..anyone?

Also, I forgot to mention............if your amp was "surgical" and didn't have low end loss I would consider this a win and not worry about an attenuator. Yes, your amp might not have that perfect sweet spot harmonic content you're used to at home but we're just talking about the ability to hear yourself live at this point.

+1 you at least need to be able to hear yourself over the friggin drummer. A loud vox mix in the monitors, and not enough stage volume to hear over a drummer is a bad night for anyone. Believe me its hard to get my marshall to a reasonable volume, but i do and its way down from practice volume, not even close to the sweet spot power wise, but i make sure i can still hear it with drums. Cant really turn that guy down lol.

 

[RACKSYSTEMS]

Period bring your own sound guy. Problem solved.

 

[Kapo_Polenton]

The important thing is that you powered through and STILL put on a show rather than taking a Portnoy-esque $hit fit.

This is probably why i see so many bands using direct recording and smaller amps. A lot of the time, they just want sound period and could careless if it is power tube or preamp distortion. This is why i got my little 4140 JCM800 all fixed up and sounding good with an effects loop so i can have one amp that is loud enough to get over a drummer but more than likely will sit barely cracked and mic'ed off to the side of the stage if ever i can get a solid band back together. I admit it looks awesome to have all that gear up there. Isn't always practical though.

 

[thegame]

Period bring your own sound guy. Problem solved.

Lots of house/headliner soundguys won't let the opening band's soundguy touch the board.

 

[thegame]

You may have heard yourself better onstage with a less gained out and thinner amp like a Marshall perhaps ?

 

[LP Freak]

Oh well. Time to suck it up and move to the next one.

 

[Mark Day]

Like Dave says bring your own guy. If that fails one of the cheapest solutions is to make sure your cab is not facing at the sound guy. 4x12's are very directional. Tell the soundguy that you normally have to wear hearing aids due to genetic hearing loss, and it would be really cool if he could pump guitar into your vocal monitor and that way you can keep the 4x12 at a lower volume. Ok so that was supposed to be funny, but it might work

I tilt my cabs back at an angle so I hear them better. I also used 2 4x12's simply because there is more coverage and because of that the volume was actually lower, but I do play quite loud. Insane as it sounds I have actually had soundmen ask me to turn up.

I also use Beam Blockers. They cut the ice picks but also disperse the sound better.

The best solution for me was to buy a trailer and PA system and be our sound guy/guitarist. The beauty of a dictatorship.
If the bar ever told us to turn down I'd say "Tell the drummer, it's his PA". We only got the turn down thing for the first set after that they never bothered us.

Mark

 

[steve_k]

You may have heard yourself better onstage with a less gained out and thinner amp like a Marshall perhaps ?

I might have heard better if he just said yes when I asked ANY guitar in the monitors.

Remember he said NO.

It was all vocals in my face.

That would require him to mess with too many Aux controls. Happens all the damn time Reza. They worry first about the FOH, then the monitor mix. By then, it is usually late in the game and he's in a hurry. Did the drummer and bassist/vocalist have any issues too with their mix, or just yours? They would have a hell of a time without you in the mix. Maybe he was underpowered or possibly your mic on the cab was shit or cable was bad. We carry our own monitor board now and control it from our ipads on the Mackie DL1608. I got tired of that shit and we all went IEM's. He can put whatever he wants in the floor monitors now, and we don't even bother with the mix.

Steve

 

[dstroud]

I hear ya man - everytime I play there my volume is rediculously low, but the guy has always given me plenty in the monitors. I think the guy does a good mix - here's a video from a show we did there, my amp was about 1/3 the volume it usually is. Was that dude from Freedom Sound there videoing you guys? If so have him send you a sample - prolly make you feel better about the show if you could hear what was out front. I'm downsizing though, seriously going to my head and a 1 x 12 for some gigs.

 

[scottywompas]

Welcome to the wild world of gigging. Unless you're a big act with your own sound guy this is going to be your experience more often than not.

Just focus on the songs and the crowd and forget all the annoyances. Don't worry so much about "Your sound" because nobody knows what your sound is anyways. Sucks for you cuz you do but once you realize that it aint gonna be perfect it's easier to just go out there and do your thing.

Scott

 

[Greazygeo]

on stages that are not deep, straight front cabs are about impossible to hear. If you like them, get another one and stack it on top where you can hear it. Or if you can make a back panel that lets part of it be open, that will let some of the sound disperse around the stage.

To get you amp running harder, try slaving. You can get killer tones at any volume level that way.

 

[Greazygeo]

Period bring your own sound guy. Problem solved.

If they let you use him. And if he can actually touch anything on the board.

 

[supersonic]

I also use Beam Blockers. They cut the ice picks but also disperse the sound better.

Mark

What are "Beam Blockers" Mark?

 

[supersonic]

on stages that are not deep, straight front cabs are about impossible to hear. If you like them, get another one and stack it on top where you can hear it. Or if you can make a back panel that lets part of it be open, that will let some of the sound disperse around the stage.

To get you amp running harder, try slaving. You can get killer tones at any volume level that way.

Good advice. Even just stack your amp up to waist level on a roadcase.

 

[bionicmark]

Reza...It's already been mentioned, but , I always locate the board when showing up to a venue in relationship to the stage. Once I do that...When allowed to bring our rigs up on stage, if facing the audience is noon on a clock , and the soundboard is in line w/ my cab , I'd aim it to around 2:30 , OR turn it 180 degrees around so it's not facing front at all. Obviously , make sure you're not blasting your drummer. You can turn it up then and people won't complain ( much ) and you can get away w/ dialing in your sound. The other...if you're an original act , bring your own sound guy who knows your set/music. He knows how you like it to sound and will work w/ the band. After all , he is the 5th or 6th member of the band that evening. Worth the $75 to $125 all night long depending how close friends you are w/ him. As far as the monitor situation is concerned. That never used to bother me..but a little trick is to stand up front parallel to the FOH speakers. Now you can hear you and what the audience is hearing as it's blazing out the speakers past you. We would always make it point to bring our own sound guy to a show..that way we don't have to deal w/ any douchebags. We'd even cut a song in our set if it took a bit to get things dialed. Piece of mind is priceless , and we would do/sacrifice anything to have it before performing.

Hope things work out on the next one!!

Mark


ps. Oh! And if you don't have your own sound guy...killing them w/ kindness works. "Yes sir.. "That would be great!" , "Thanks so much!" , "I really appreciate it" , Not a problem." , etc.. you get the idea.
( turns up master as the intro music is playing ) oops!!

 

[Peter Diezel]

Tonight my new band played our first show. We rehearsed in 5 hour blocks 2 times a week for over 16 months. We spent around 4k on our full length recording.
We incurred all the overhead costs of driving , gas , time management.
To be a good band.
I personally have spent over 30k on my music equipment, everything I thought I would need along the way. Some forever items (looking at you gold top)

We got to the venue and the headliner was soundchecking.
Load in.
Wait.
We get set up in record time and the FOH sound guy "Phil"
Tells me to turn down immediately.

I have a mic (of unknown origin) on a FL Diezel v30 4x12
I provided him with a direct line via Palmer Pdi-09

I don't think he even used it. I think hated my face.


My VH4 is at 9'oclock, the amp isn't even opened up at ALL.

By now I'm completely bummed, it's not my sound. It's not the sound of MY Band.
I need to at least get this amp to 10.5 to start it cranking.

The monitor system is ALL vox.

Our drummer had to set up in front of the headliners riser. Fine.

After the first song I (desperately) cried to the soundman, "can I get more guitar in the monitor?" . "NO!" He yelled back.

We plowed into the next 8 songs.

Couldn't hear myself at all. Played with all muscle memory.

Blasted by the sound of the too loud Vox, NO Bass, and loud drums right next to me.


Awesome. So that happened.

I might have the biggest gear sell off ever in a few minutes.

Reza, I´m sorry to hear that but it makes no sense to discuss.
I had about 2000 shows in the 80´s and 90´s and it´s just a fact that
99,9% of all FOH´s are not in the condition to get a fat guitar
sound into the mix. It´s either quiet or bright. Bring your own
buddy to the console and do the soundcheck by yourself.

Don´t give up

 

[japetus]

^ you should have turned your amp toward the drummer, or back toward the back of the stage.

 

[japetus]

Also, I can't believe you guys spent 15 months and that much cash before you played a show. Shows make bands tighter and better, not spending a ton on gear and slick sounding recordings. Not trying to be a dick at all, just honest.

 

[rocknrolla]

Of course you can't hear yourself when you're turned down, 2 feet in front of a straight cab, 3 feet from the drummer, and vox in your monitor. You need one of these.