Looking for more information from Rig-talk's most knowledgeable

  • Thread starter Thread starter Smash
  • Start date Start date
I have no problem with 100W amps. What I am addressing is 100W-only-ism and 4x12 only-isms for TONE.

A 100W won't keep up with it either in your model.

A regular metal drummer is going between 110dB to 130dB

That 130dB is already over max 100W high gain amp.

So let's go with your drummers hitting at even higher dB because they are special.

That doesn't just end it for 20W. It ends it for 100W also. There is 3dB difference in double wattage. Do you know how many Watts you actually need for the 130dB+ scenario? Doubling is 3dB!

Anyway, the reason why you actually don't need those huge wattage numbers is that the guitar is a mid-range instrument. It isn't competing with the loudest frequencies of the drummer. It just needs to be louder than the mid-range and high-hats.

Most of the people here forwarding 100W-onlyism will eventually be backed into claims about lack of low-end from lower wattage amps and chest thumps. Basically, they have decided they are competing with drummers and the bass player for lower frequencies. Drop A Slipknot. B Standard Machine head. Then claiming their special sound engineers are able to make sure that their low-end is audible and therefore the higher wattage amp paid off. That's how specialized this argument for 100W-only-ism gets with high gain amps.

BTW, I am actually naming amps that can compete here. Marshall Studios. Mesa MK25. Friedman 20s and 30s. Some of those are technically not high-gain amps but can be played high-gain when boosted.

You'd be wrong. My 5150 II had no problem keeping up with him. Granted the bitch was cranked to 6.5, but it had no problem with two 4x12s.

Also you need to do some research on speaker efficiency and realize within the ability to maximize loudness exists a direct correlation to total cone surface area creating the sound waves. It's not just the source, its the transducer efficiency and the total number of them that counts.
 
If people here said "Hey I use a 100W for the headroom or for more volume" then that would be no argument. It's the claim that lower wattage amps can't replicate the tone of their big brothers that is questionable because some models are doing exactly just that to the point that nobody can tell the difference in a recording and yes, some are indeed gig-ready and able to compete with the loudest drummer in the room. What they don't compete with is.... their bigger brother amps of higher wattage for volume. That's it. Some lower wattage amps are bad. Like some 100W amps are also bad.



THEY DONT FUCKING SOUND THE SAME. YOU DONT KNOW SHIT ABOUT FUCK.
 
It's not about "those" controls any longer for
the next up and blow jobbers'.
A lot of music is now created and put together
by machines..a button here &
a "lightning in the bottle" digital fader..

New musical instruments will be created,
leaving instruments made of wood etc
for the "caveman musician's".

Soon you'll be able to hologram Hendrix from
Monterey in your jam room and trade licks and war stories, smoke digital dope..etc.

I'll f'n say it again man, I STILL don't trust
'Bishop' from the motion picture "Aliens".
Why the f*** not man?
Because from start to finish..,
he's a bucket of bolts.

PS, there's no way Ripley could have survived
that airlock opening up by wedging her arm
& body weight through that launch
chamber handle.
She worked that loader fo'sure though!
"Not bad for a human".
-Hey Bishop, 'FU*K YOU' you bucket of bolts!-
 
It's not about "those" controls any longer for
the next up and blow jobbers'.
A lot of music is now created and put together
by machines..a button here &
a "lightning in the bottle" digital fader..

New musical instruments will be created,
leaving instruments made of wood etc
for the "caveman musician's".

Soon you'll be able to hologram Hendrix from
Monterey in your jam room and trade licks and war stories, smoke digital dope..etc.

I'll f'n say it again man, I STILL don't trust
'Bishop' from the motion picture "Aliens".
Why the f*** not man?
Because from start to finish..,
he's a bucket of bolts.

PS, there's no way Ripley could have survived
that airlock opening up by wedging her arm
& body weight through that launch
chamber handle.
She worked that loader fo'sure though!
"Not bad for a human".
-Hey Bishop, 'FU*K YOU' you bucket of bolts!-
I never know what the fuck you are talking about....But I am glad you are saying it.
 
I never know what the fuck you are talking about....But I am glad you are saying it.
Dude, I do realise this as I'm typing..
"Mining the seam"..- David Gilmour's description
of improvisation.
That's pretty bad ass man.
F**k..did I just do what you're pertaining to again??
AGREED!

Looks like tonight fellas..,
I NEED TO WALK HOME BOY.
F-it, just Wim Huff it the whole way home.
Taking one for the RT team.-peace out.
 
Last edited:
Hey Smashedguitarist, there's something I should mention & I truely think you'll be proud of dude.
I recently challenged a man over on TGP to an all
out old school Robbin Ford "Politician" showdown.
He gets to used his Dumble thingy,
I'm using a Marshall JVM 410H, Channel 1 green mode dimed intoa dimed Electro-Harmonix Big Muff OpAmp pedal and a buttery-ass partscaster.

I'm doing all my own tracks also, he can hitch a ride on that 'Blue Line' all he needs.
I'm still in Jedi knight study mode, there's much to be said for those melodic extensions.

My band for this is called:
"The Andromeda Strain".
Not just for paying homage to that KILLER
SciFi gore motion picture from the 80's
but...it's that...,
"Straining while slightly hemorrhaging a
hairy sustained note",
Like ..anger shitting.,
from denial of constipation?
Dude, I gotta get back at it.
Keep this on the DL.
 
It's not about "those" controls any longer for
the next up and blow jobbers'.
A lot of music is now created and put together
by machines..a button here &
a "lightning in the bottle" digital fader..

New musical instruments will be created,
leaving instruments made of wood etc
for the "caveman musician's".

Soon you'll be able to hologram Hendrix from
Monterey in your jam room and trade licks and war stories, smoke digital dope..etc.

I'll f'n say it again man, I STILL don't trust
'Bishop' from the motion picture "Aliens".
Why the f*** not man?
Because from start to finish..,
he's a bucket of bolts.

PS, there's no way Ripley could have survived
that airlock opening up by wedging her arm
& body weight through that launch
chamber handle.
She worked that loader fo'sure though!
"Not bad for a human".
-Hey Bishop, 'FU*K YOU' you bucket of bolts!-
Not to mention, Ripley and Bishop left that Alien queen to float freely through outer space. That's a non-release violation right there.
 
Hey Smashedguitarist, there's something I should mention & I truely think you'll be proud of dude.
I recently challenged a man over on TGP to an all
out old school Robbin Ford "Politician" showdown.
He gets to used his Dumble thingy,
I'm using a Marshall JVM 410H, Channel 1 green mode dimed intoa dimed Electro-Harmonix Big Muff OpAmp pedal and a buttery-ass partscaster.

I'm doing all my own tracks also, he can hitch a ride on that 'Blue Line' all he needs.
I'm still in Jedi knight study mode, there's much to be said for those melodic extensions.

My band for this is called:
"The Andromeda Strain".
Not just for paying homage to that KILLER
SciFi gore motion picture from the 80's
but...it's that...,
"Straining while slightly hemorrhaging a
hairy sustained note",
Like ..anger shitting.,
from denial of constipation?
Dude, I gotta get back at it.
Keep this on the DL.
I will tell no one, my liege.
 
Disaster of a forum. Simply pathetic.

Absolutely. What we need is more people paying attention to the valuable musical lessons to be learned in the Charlie Brown Christmas Special.

"When you watch 'A Charlie Brown Christmas' this year, notice the part where Lucy asks Schroeder to play Jingle Bells. He attempts to entertain Lucy with various harmonic renditions on the composition, though, Lucy is unimpressed. Schroeder is eventually reduced to playing the melody only, to which Lucy celebrates! Think about it..."

Or, who can forget the piss-ignorant "I only play melody, not leads" and "notes are polluted with distortion" stuff that literally only old people who fucking suck at guitar say?

"You should try backing-away from using distortion, and focus on learning how to play the instrument. Banging around on two-note power chords with heaping distortion and delay is counterintuitive. As a beginner, you shouldn't be using distortion, at all. You need to be memorizing notes, and you can't do that when the notes are polluted with distortion.

When the time comes, you can begin to introduce pre-amplification distortion and echo effects. Once you become a proficient harmonic player, you can begin focusing on learning melody. i.e. Lead. Melodic playing must be using collectively and contextually. Without backing, melody should be restricted to arpeggiation. e.g. Hotel California.


Hot damn! That may be the dumbest, smuggest, most condescending shit I've ever read. And I used to be on TGP alot.

In fact, you should start your own forum, where you can bestow upon the guitar playing public your pants-shittingly retarded boomer guitar advice.

Think about it! You can have a whole cult full of real musicians like Mark Skid, plinking away on "Mary Had a Little Lamb" and "Frere Jacques" with pristine jazz chorus clean tones! The notes won't be "polluted" with distortion or power chords! ....


...and you'll be there instead of here.
 
SLO30BM-large.jpg

SLO30.

Yet another sub 50W amp that the 100W-only-ists will claim is impossible to replicate the high-gains tones of its bigger brother and isn't gig-ready.

Guess that guitarist needs to be taught a lesson so let's call them names and hurl insults like it will stop that thing from ripping your band's logos off from your t-shirts while blowing your hair back at -5db less than its bigger brother with the same signature tone.

It should be obvious 100W is completely a human subjective number rounded off and not because at 100W tone happens.

The moral of the story is people are using these modern sub 50W high gain amps to achieve goals reaching more than 90% of what they need from the 100W bigger brothers which are becoming more and more specialized as time goes on.
 
Last edited:
SLO30BM-large.jpg

SLO30.

Yet another sub 50W amp that the 100W-only-ists will claim is impossible to replicate the high-gains tones of its bigger brother and isn't gig-ready.

Guess that guitarist needs to be taught a lesson so let's call them names and hurl insults like it will stop that thing from ripping your band's logos off from your t-shirts while blowing your hair back at -5db less than its bigger brother with the same signature tone.

It should be obvious 100W is completely a human subjective number rounded off and not because at 100W tone happens.

The moral of the story is people are using these modern sub 50W high gain amps to achieve goals reaching more than 90% of what they need from the 100W bigger brothers which are becoming more and more specialized as time goes on.
I use a pick to break rock, while you use your head. And yet, I tire first.
 
The guy who says 100W amps are useless has written a book about "bedroom electric guitar". You can't make up such a thing as that. LOL
 
SLO30BM-large.jpg

SLO30.

Yet another sub 50W amp that the 100W-only-ists will claim is impossible to replicate the high-gains tones of its bigger brother and isn't gig-ready.

Guess that guitarist needs to be taught a lesson so let's call them names and hurl insults like it will stop that thing from ripping your band's logos off from your t-shirts while blowing your hair back at -5db less than its bigger brother with the same signature tone.

It should be obvious 100W is completely a human subjective number rounded off and not because at 100W tone happens.

The moral of the story is people are using these modern sub 50W high gain amps to achieve goals reaching more than 90% of what they need from the 100W bigger brothers which are becoming more and more specialized as time goes on.
We put a SLO30 against a common Peavey 5150 block logo and the difference was massive. The 5150 ate it for breakfast not in volume but character and tonal preference. Not a single person in the room thought the SLO30 sounded better. The next day my friend had no problem selling the SLO30 for a profit.
 
Well of course he will say it’s impossible for larger amps to sound better, he wrote a book about it therefore it must be true! To think an entire forum disagrees with him is impossible! But -3dB!
I discuss plenty of 100W+ amps in my book so that will disprove that strawman not to mention the zero evidence for any quote to back up what you just made up.

The guy who says 100W amps are useless has written a book about "bedroom electric guitar". You can't make up such a thing as that. LOL
Who said that?

Any attenuator worth it's salt can run big Iron in any bedroom. Several chapters about it.

You can do a 180W Herbert in your bedroom if you want.

I use 50W in small room setups because usually, they do what the 100W can do in many cases. It is why amp makers have been producing 50W versions of their 100W amps for 40+ years. So obviously the claim you need 100W for high-gain tone is just plain wrong on a historical accounting for some medium to higher gain amps tonal histories in studios using 50W versions. So we can dispense with this idea everyone playing 100W amps on stage used 100W for recording. 50W was doing that for this reason.

40 years later the same amp makers are delivering studio packages in 20W to 30W instead of the 50W because they are doing what some say can't be done (signature tone) SLO30, Marshall Studios, Mesa MK25 can't do their big brother big tones? They are just the modern version of the 50W studios. They are still louder than the loudest drummer in the room. They are just not louder than a 100W cranked if you play that loud.
 
Back
Top