Reflection of the times?

[mbman]

I actually play all my guitars and amps and I love having many different things to choose from. It's that simple. Some of you are over thinking this just a bit.

+1

Some nights I'll play just one guitar, other nights I may play three or more and play through just as many amps. It's about enjoying a variety of tones simple as that

Martin

 

[fuzzyguitars]

I love playing my same 3 chord songs through my 50 different boutique heads and 50 rare guitars.

It really lets you hear the subtle nuances that you can achieve.

Oh yes let's not forget my first position pentatonic riff that I always play.


While I am at it, I think I will post a video and some clips!

 

[RSRD]

I love playing my same 3 chord songs through my 50 different boutique heads and 50 rare guitars.

It really lets you hear the subtle nuances that you can achieve.

Oh yes let's not forget my first position pentatonic riff that I always play.


While I am at it, I think I will post a video and some clips!

Most people don't know pattern #1 pentatonic. They just play pattern #2. Get it right Steve

 

[LukeCurd]

I think its just a guitar player thing. Bass players rarely chase other peoples tone to sound like someone else. Drummers might borrow fills and such from their hero's but most of the time its just them and a junk kit. Best musicians I have found don't give a shit about gear. That's when I started to re think keeping up with the Joneses.

When my gear addiction was at it's worst I had 5 guitars and 12 space rack full and a stack. That was about 10k in 2003 dollars. Not sure what it would be 10 years later. I bought a $200 acoustic and wrote some great songs on it. Gear doesn't matter, however playing a nice amp and guitar is a great feeling. It doesn't write better songs.

If you want to play like me you need this!

 

[dirtyfunkg]

I think I see both sides to it. I don't know that I'm envious per se--if I had roadies and an a tech or techs on call, I'd definitely want a lot of gear.
For lots of stuff though, I've heard cheaper gear do just as well. Some amps have their own tone, etc., which is a big reason why I prefer VHT/Fryette, but, as an example, I could build a parts Strat for much less than a Suhr, Pensa, or Fender AVRI but quality will stand up with a Warmoth neck. And, fundamentally, I've heard amazing guitarists play through an old, shitty Yamaha solid state amp with an Epiphone Bully and a Marshall Jackhammer and sound infinitely better than that mediocre guitarist with the PRS and Bogner.

I guess I never really got the hype with some gear. Other gear would be closet queens because I'd be too scared to take them out and gig them in the real world.

I think I've gotten to the point now where I'm actually trying to sell off a bunch of gear so that I can just run with what I actually use. I have a Carvin X100B, Peavey VTM-60, and a Mills Afterburner cab that I simply don't use and have no use for anymore. Thin that out, make some space, and I think you'd find me looking more intently at studio and live gear (microphones, the Behringer X32 is looking mighty tempting, and maybe some compressors), etc. I might look into a piezo system for a couple of my guitars to have that aspect at my disposal also.

So, in a sense, I guess I get it. I've just found what works for me (for now), and am happy with it. If I've got a couple guitars with decent necks and unplugged tone, I'll modify the rest to make it what I need it to be.

 

[Ventura]

Too much time on the net being armchair rockstars, not enough time spent hammering out the riffs - jammin - giggin - recordin.

That's it that's all.

 

[rupe]

Too much time on the net being armchair rockstars, not enough time spent hammering out the riffs - jammin - giggin - recordin.

That's it that's all.

Word

 

[rlord1974]

I've heard amazing guitarists play through an old, shitty Yamaha solid state amp with an Epiphone Bully and a Marshall Jackhammer and sound infinitely better than that mediocre guitarist with the PRS and Bogner.

That's right, and it's because at least 50% of good "tone" comes from the player's hands, not their gear.

A player could have a $4k Bogner and a $6k Les Paul and, if their playing technique sucks, so too will their "tone". Then, that same player could hand their Les Paul to another player with solid playing technique and, without even changing the settings on the amp, he could have phenomenal tone.

So much of a player's "tone" comes from their hands. The picking hand technique is the most important, because the way the strings are "attacked" is critical to the sound that is produced by the instrument and, ultimately, the "tone" that is coming out of the amplifier. That being said, the fretting hand definitely plays an important role as well.

And, just to be clear, when I refer to "playing technique", I don't mean how difficult or challenging the parts being played need to be from a dexterity or coordination standpoint. The player does not need to be able to play 'Eruption' upside down with one arm. Or, be able to play that style of music at all, for that matter. The player just needs to have an appreciation for how to maximize the quality of the "voice" coming from the instrument. It could be a blues player playing a 3-chord shuffle and a pentatonic scale. Or, it could be a classical player playing fingerstyle on a nylon-stringed guitar. The concept applies equally to all types of guitars and all genres of music.

This theory is easily proven in practice. Go find a "hack" that has been playing for one year and an experienced player that has been playing for many years and then have them play through the same $10k rig with the same settings and listen to the results.

If you disagree with this, then you're more likely than not the "hack".

That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

 

[killertone]

Could not care less what others have as far as music gear goes. Seriously.

Collectors are different than flippers. However, most of both play like shit. Doesn't diminish their right to own whatever they want it has just been my experience over the years working in music stores and hanging on guitar forums. But God bless 'em, they sure do take a beating on all the gear they flip. Gotta love that.

For me, it is pretty hard to be envious of someone who may have more gear than you but sounds like a 9 lb. bag of dicks when he plays.

 

[Chubtone]

I have too much gear and it makes me feel guilty when I look at all of it and am not using it for what I intended to when I purchased it. I always tell myself I am going to record this or that when I buy something, but I am too lazy to actually do it most of the time.

One thing touched upon in this thread already is this sort of superiority complex or credibility factor people are bestowing on themselves based on their gear purchases and the anger others feel when you eventually hear a clip of this player and you are less than impressed. It actually does create resentment. But it's not a jealousy of the gear in my opinion, but an anger at being led to think, "maybe I do need better gear" or that maybe your ear isn't as good as this guys is. Then people hear the guy in a clip or at NAMM or whatever and start making negative comments to that person and the target of it chalks it up to jealousy or sour grapes.

I have had the gear I love trashed or downplayed by several members of different forums repeatedly over the years and it can make you wonder if you are on the right path. Then sometimes you hear a clip of them playing and you just want to slap them for causing you to second guess yourself or for elevating them to a place where their opinion mattered to you.

There is a local sales rep that was a very successful guy in a different business. I have been reading his reviews on the big gear forum for years. They are very well-written and after every single one of them, I am ready to plunk down the money and buy whatever it is he is reviewing. A couple of months back he came in to my store and introduced himself. To be honest, I got a little bit excited to meet him. We started talking and he is "retired" but now partnered in a pedal company with a friend of his. AWESOME! Let's hear the pedals!

So he looks around the store at the half dozen or so USA strats hanging there and asks if I have anything vintage or custom shop. Sorry, not at the present time. So he goes out to his car and grabs his custom shop "beater" strat. Then he starts looking for a Fender clean tube amp to demo with his strat and his pedals. He is not happy with my Vibroverb reissue, the Blues DeVille or the Blues Jr. So, out to his car he goes again for the vintage Super Reverb. He has looked down his nose at everything I had sitting there, and drags in gear that he considered "good enough" for him.

You all know what is coming next. I honestly thought he was kidding around to mess with me. The guy made the faces and tilted his head back like he was killing it. His playing was absolutely atrocious. He couldn't bend from one note to the other and hear when it was in tune. If you can't hear pitch, don't try and convince me you can hear tone. So now I am pissed at being deceived for so long by his reviews and his opinions. I really thought he was a guy to listen to. And I feel sorry for his business partner who may or may not have created some good sounding pedals. How will anyone who hears this guy demo them know?

There are entirely too many of that guy on the forums these days. This forum is not the worst with that though. But still, I think that is the cause of so much of the animosity. It is a resentment, but maybe not as $$$ driven as the targets of it think.

 

[thegame]

From a different perspective, I think just about 100 % of my favorite artists made their best work when they had a minimal amount of gear to work with (not talking about quality, just quantity). When some of these artists got relatively rich and successful and the endorsements/free gear start piling in, even big league players can get awash in a sea of endless gear choices, taking time away from practicing, songwriting, etc.

 

[Chubtone]

From a different perspective, I think just about 100 % of my favorite artists made their best work when they had a minimal amount of gear to work with (not talking about quality, just quantity). When some of these artists got relatively rich and successful and the endorsements/free gear start piling in, even big league players can get awash in a sea of endless gear choices, taking time away from practicing, songwriting, etc.

I agree with this! It is almost embarrassing to me that my gear is better than the gear used to record 99% of my favorite all time tones.

And forum guys are the only ones who think they need a $10k guitar and amp rig to recreate what their favorite player did with a Marshall worth $800 and a $60 pedal and $1000 guitar.

 

[glpg80]

From a different perspective, I think just about 100 % of my favorite artists made their best work when they had a minimal amount of gear to work with (not talking about quality, just quantity). When some of these artists got relatively rich and successful and the endorsements/free gear start piling in, even big league players can get awash in a sea of endless gear choices, taking time away from practicing, songwriting, etc.

I agree with this! It is almost embarrassing to me that my gear is better than the gear used to record 99% of my favorite all time tones.

And forum guys are the only ones who think they need a $10k guitar and amp rig to recreate what their favorite player did with a Marshall worth $800 and a $60 pedal and $1000 guitar.

Not everyone on the forum is chasing a fallacy of someone else's recorded tone though. Personally i know what tones i like, do not like, and how it is best to get them - whether or not they come close to nailing something else is entirely different. Some people flip gear because they dont have a clue. Others hoard it in denial, do not use it to its full advantage, or the smallest group who use it/gig it/record it/play it and know it very very well. I was always under the assumption you should always know what you're looking for and have the ability to differentiate between the masses the best method to get close. Getting there 100% will never happen, but the rest can be made with studio polishing and mic choices. These days even modelers come into play to fill in the gap.

What is sad is that most people still differentiate price with quality. The only thing you can guarantee is that they will sound different. Better is subjective, and a price point is simply a price point. In reality its a mute point that should not even be compared.

 

[Jofipe]

From a different perspective, I think just about 100 % of my favorite artists made their best work when they had a minimal amount of gear to work with (not talking about quality, just quantity). When some of these artists got relatively rich and successful and the endorsements/free gear start piling in, even big league players can get awash in a sea of endless gear choices, taking time away from practicing, songwriting, etc.

I agree with this! It is almost embarrassing to me that my gear is better than the gear used to record 99% of my favorite all time tones.

And forum guys are the only ones who think they need a $10k guitar and amp rig to recreate what their favorite player did with a Marshall worth $800 and a $60 pedal and $1000 guitar.

Freakin aye!

Overconsumption makes ppl fat and lazy... just like food.

 

[Anonymous]

I have too much gear and it makes me feel guilty when I look at all of it and am not using it for what I intended to when I purchased it. I always tell myself I am going to record this or that when I buy something, but I am too lazy to actually do it most of the time.

One thing touched upon in this thread already is this sort of superiority complex or credibility factor people are bestowing on themselves based on their gear purchases and the anger others feel when you eventually hear a clip of this player and you are less than impressed. It actually does create resentment. But it's not a jealousy of the gear in my opinion, but an anger at being led to think, "maybe I do need better gear" or that maybe your ear isn't as good as this guys is. Then people hear the guy in a clip or at NAMM or whatever and start making negative comments to that person and the target of it chalks it up to jealousy or sour grapes.

I have had the gear I love trashed or downplayed by several members of different forums repeatedly over the years and it can make you wonder if you are on the right path. Then sometimes you hear a clip of them playing and you just want to slap them for causing you to second guess yourself or for elevating them to a place where their opinion mattered to you.

There is a local sales rep that was a very successful guy in a different business. I have been reading his reviews on the big gear forum for years. They are very well-written and after every single one of them, I am ready to plunk down the money and buy whatever it is he is reviewing. A couple of months back he came in to my store and introduced himself. To be honest, I got a little bit excited to meet him. We started talking and he is "retired" but now partnered in a pedal company with a friend of his. AWESOME! Let's hear the pedals!

So he looks around the store at the half dozen or so USA strats hanging there and asks if I have anything vintage or custom shop. Sorry, not at the present time. So he goes out to his car and grabs his custom shop "beater" strat. Then he starts looking for a Fender clean tube amp to demo with his strat and his pedals. He is not happy with my Vibroverb reissue, the Blues DeVille or the Blues Jr. So, out to his car he goes again for the vintage Super Reverb. He has looked down his nose at everything I had sitting there, and drags in gear that he considered "good enough" for him.

You all know what is coming next. I honestly thought he was kidding around to mess with me. The guy made the faces and tilted his head back like he was killing it. His playing was absolutely atrocious. He couldn't bend from one note to the other and hear when it was in tune. If you can't hear pitch, don't try and convince me you can hear tone. So now I am pissed at being deceived for so long by his reviews and his opinions. I really thought he was a guy to listen to. And I feel sorry for his business partner who may or may not have created some good sounding pedals. How will anyone who hears this guy demo them know?

There are entirely too many of that guy on the forums these days. This forum is not the worst with that though. But still, I think that is the cause of so much of the animosity. It is a resentment, but maybe not as $$$ driven as the targets of it think.

I think the bottom line is you can only trust your own ears. Almost any piece of gear you can buy you can get a refund if you don't dig it. If you hear some clips that intrigue you, you can either get to a store and try it, or buy it direct and send it back if you don't like it. That is why I offer a 7 day money back guarantee on my amps. You can't play 'em in stores, it only makes sense...

I also don't necessarily understand why a guy has to be able to play well to hear tone. Some of the best VH tone clips I ever heard were done by one of the worst players I have ever heard over on the Metro forum. The guy is just terrible, but I could still hear that the tone was there and that if someone with some decent chops were playing it, it would sound very much like VH. Also, the guy was having a lot of fun and enjoying his tone quest, so what's the problem? Sure, the good players can sit there and look down on him (hell, even I've done it) and say, "Shit, if you spent 1/100th of the time actually practicing rather than tweaking cathode resistors on your Super Lead, you'd probably BE EVH by now.", but who are we to judge how the guys spends his time and what makes him happy?

I enjoy building amps, playing, trying out different gear and buying/selling/trading guitars in whatever spare time I have. It's fun for me. I don't need to prove anything to anybody in terms of my playing, practicing, gigging, recording, etc. to justify any of it. If people wanna trust my ear for tone, fine, if not, also fine. We should all do whatever the hell we want and not judge each other so much... and while I say this, I fully admit I've been just as guilty of this in the past... won't do it again though...

Steve

 

[Chubtone]

Steve,
That guy you are talking about is humble and cool though. He never comes off like he is an authority. he always seemed to kind of float under the radar in threads with Ralle and Rockstah and after years, yeah, he nailed it. He was so obsessed with that particular tone I think he is a little more dialed in on playing how he does, but knowing how to achieve that particular tone.

Maybe what I should have said is that the guys I'm talking about think they know good tone because they hear a great player through a rig and look at what is in the rig and then buy it because they recognize "good tone". That player who inspired them to buy that rig could have inspired them to buy any of 20 different rigs that same day if that is what they had been playing instead.

The test becomes, if they know good tone, do you think they could take that guys same rig with everything on zero and dial in a killer tone by themselves with them playing through it. My guess is that 9 out of 10 times they couldn't. That one out of ten times is the guy you are talking about that you used to shoot down my argument completely.

 

[Anonymous]

Steve,
That guy you are talking about is humble and cool though. He never comes off like he is an authority. he always seemed to kind of float under the radar in threads with Ralle and Rockstah and after years, yeah, he nailed it. He was so obsessed with that particular tone I think he is a little more dialed in on playing how he does, but knowing how to achieve that particular tone.

Maybe what I should have said is that the guys I'm talking about think they know good tone because they hear a great player through a rig and look at what is in the rig and then buy it because they recognize "good tone". That player who inspired them to buy that rig could have inspired them to buy any of 20 different rigs that same day if that is what they had been playing instead.

The test becomes, if they know good tone, do you think they could take that guys same rig with everything on zero and dial in a killer tone by themselves with them playing through it. My guess is that 9 out of 10 times they couldn't. That one out of ten times is the guy you are talking about that you used to shoot down my argument completely.

Well, see, here's the thing. An asshole acting like an authority is no fun whether he can play and dial tones or not, so I just discount any asshole to start with. My only real point is that if a guy owns tons of gear and is not a good player, but is having fun participating in the conversation, who cares, it's his time and money. We can all make up our own minds on what gear we want and decide who's ears we trust...

Steve

 

[guitarmike]

Steve,
That guy you are talking about is humble and cool though. He never comes off like he is an authority. he always seemed to kind of float under the radar in threads with Ralle and Rockstah and after years, yeah, he nailed it. He was so obsessed with that particular tone I think he is a little more dialed in on playing how he does, but knowing how to achieve that particular tone.

Maybe what I should have said is that the guys I'm talking about think they know good tone because they hear a great player through a rig and look at what is in the rig and then buy it because they recognize "good tone". That player who inspired them to buy that rig could have inspired them to buy any of 20 different rigs that same day if that is what they had been playing instead.

The test becomes, if they know good tone, do you think they could take that guys same rig with everything on zero and dial in a killer tone by themselves with them playing through it. My guess is that 9 out of 10 times they couldn't. That one out of ten times is the guy you are talking about that you used to shoot down my argument completely.

Well, see, here's the thing. An asshole acting like an authority is no fun whether he can play and dial tones or not, so I just discount any asshole to start with. My only real point is that if a guy owns tons of gear and is not a good player, but is having fun participating in the conversation, who cares, it's his time and money. We can all make up our own minds on what gear we want and decide who's ears we trust...

Steve

There are so many aspects to the guitar hobby. Playing, tone seeking, collecting, building, recording, etc. If you are happy doing any part of it or parts of it, more power to you. Enjoy the chase no matter what you chase, it can be a lifetime of fun.

 

[dirtyfunkg]

Take guys like BB King, Chuck Schuldiner, Dimebag, and even Jonny Greenwood. The tones fit the music amazingly well. The amps can be had for under $400 in today's used market. I'm talking Lab Series, Marshall Valvestate, Randall RG100es, and Fender Deluxe 85 respectively.

What I think is weird is if someone came on these forums and hardcore repped the hell out of these types of pieces, their opinions would be discounted completely versus the Bogner, Fortin, Friedman, and vintage Marshall players, and they'd probably be laughed out of the forum. So maybe the resentment is that the player can be judged by the gear. I used to think, "Oh, this guy plays a Bogner, therefore he must be pro," only to find that I play out more frequently and can play circles around many of them. What it usually means is they're a professional non-musician... hence them actually having the money to buy such gear .

But, again, I think I learned really early on that the dude who can really play is usually the dude who's too broke to afford really nice gear, or can't be bothered to spend the time looking for a guitar, but rather are seeking out new techniques, theory, etc to become a better player.

Nothing wrong with anyone having gear or seeking it. I think it can get ridiculous when someone is judged by the gear they do or do not have, whether on a forum or in real life.

 

[Gainiac]

LADIES PLEEEEEZE, THIS IS ROCK AND ROLL WTF IS THE MATTER WITH YOU???!??

if not for the existence of EXCESS THERE WOULD BE NOTHING TO SHOOT FOR, NO REASON TO GET UP IN THE MORNING!!!!!! MORE GUITARS!!! MORE AMPS!!!! MORE SHOWS!!!! MORE HOOKERS!!!! MORE EVERYTHING!!!!!!! WTF HAPPENED HERE WHILE I WAS GONE!!!??!??? BRAD??!?? SAV?!!? STEVE?!??? what ARE you PEOPLE DOING, DID WE ALL GO VEGAN WHEN I WASNT LOOKING??!??
Ugggggghhhhh..... I'm gonna go play my 54th Strat thru my 14th Marshall... screw you guys....