stratjacket
Well-known member
I use EQ in the loop and another EQ before pedals. Both always on.
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demondestroyer
Well-known member
If I recall correctly Darrell only used the flanger doubler in the loop and his blue 6 band eq and furman pq 3 or pq 4 was in front.
rottingcorpse
Well-known member
We hear that a lot. Just saying....
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demondestroyer
Well-known member
Is it true? IDK you tell me. Didnt you know him personally? Not trying to be a smartass just wanting to know the truth.
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psychodave
Well-known member
I sold it to Steve K. New from Mike B is was $3k. Too expensive, but there is no substitute.
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ErikT
Well-known member
Dude, wow. That is amazing!
* velcro-fly *
Well-known member
That’s the one I use in the loop with the Wiz but it’s set flat and for clean volume boost only, works like a charm
NoAridTone
New member
Did you ever find the tone you wanted from the Grace? I’ve got his warm machine and black flag amps and love them. I’m actually hoping to buy a Grace myself.
TheGreatGreen
Well-known member
If I could only have two pedals on my board, I'd have two EQ pedals. Seriously. I'd have an EQ just after my guitar and an EQ in the loop.
It is insane how powerful EQ is and it's even more insane to me that EQ pedals aren't vastly more popular than they are. So many guitar players are looking for that one last magical ingredient that will take their core tone from being "good enough" to being exactly what they want, and I've always found EQ to be exactly that.
However, for some reason, a lot of players want to force themselves to live by some kind of Samurai Honor Code with their tone where they believe some methods of improving their sound are Honorable and Good, while others are Dishonorable and Shameful. Add an overdrive pedal? Well, that's "enhancing" your tone, so that is Honorable. But add an external EQ? Well, that is "fixing" your tone, and if you have to fix your tone then obviously your gear isn't up to par. Shameful! Dishonorable! Why is it this way with EQ? Is it because the amp already has a tonestack? What about the overdrive pedal then? Does the amp not also already have a Gain knob? Oh it does? So what's the difference? The answer is that there is no difference.
People should stop hamstringing their own happiness by thinking some stuff "enhances" while other stuff "fixes." Both words mean "to improve." However, the psychological trick is that "enhances" means "to improve from good to great" while "fixes" means "to improve from bad to good." The only difference between these terms is the arbitrary start and end points people visualize for them. They think that using one type of effect will force themselves to admit that their gear isn't good and needs "help" while using another effect is simply just "customizing" or whatever.
Stop thinking like that!
Everything you do to your tone is simply moving it closer to or farther from what you want it to be. Music is 100% aesthetic. All that matters is what comes out of the speakers. Allow yourself the freedom to use the right tools to get the job done.
It is insane how powerful EQ is and it's even more insane to me that EQ pedals aren't vastly more popular than they are. So many guitar players are looking for that one last magical ingredient that will take their core tone from being "good enough" to being exactly what they want, and I've always found EQ to be exactly that.
However, for some reason, a lot of players want to force themselves to live by some kind of Samurai Honor Code with their tone where they believe some methods of improving their sound are Honorable and Good, while others are Dishonorable and Shameful. Add an overdrive pedal? Well, that's "enhancing" your tone, so that is Honorable. But add an external EQ? Well, that is "fixing" your tone, and if you have to fix your tone then obviously your gear isn't up to par. Shameful! Dishonorable! Why is it this way with EQ? Is it because the amp already has a tonestack? What about the overdrive pedal then? Does the amp not also already have a Gain knob? Oh it does? So what's the difference? The answer is that there is no difference.
People should stop hamstringing their own happiness by thinking some stuff "enhances" while other stuff "fixes." Both words mean "to improve." However, the psychological trick is that "enhances" means "to improve from good to great" while "fixes" means "to improve from bad to good." The only difference between these terms is the arbitrary start and end points people visualize for them. They think that using one type of effect will force themselves to admit that their gear isn't good and needs "help" while using another effect is simply just "customizing" or whatever.
Stop thinking like that!
Everything you do to your tone is simply moving it closer to or farther from what you want it to be. Music is 100% aesthetic. All that matters is what comes out of the speakers. Allow yourself the freedom to use the right tools to get the job done.
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cetanu
Well-known member
The funny thing is that using a TS to "tighten" up a high gain amp for example means usually just adding a high-pass filter @~720Hz and a low-pass filter @~3kHz to the signal and raising the gain by a few dB before it's fed into the amp. Nothing someone couldn't achieve with a simple EQ with the exception that it's fixed in your typical boost/overdrive pedal and you don't have any control over the frequency roll-off points but luckily there are also exceptions like the VFE Standout & Dragon or Pettyjohn Lift that have variable HPF and LPF filters.
Many manufacturers and amp designers do already offer variable Pre-EQ/filtering so that you're able to tweak your tone Pre & Post distortion. Examples range from a Sansamp PSA (Buzz, Punch, Crunch), to Fryette (Gain I & II) to a Larry (Punch & Bite) but those are far from the only let alone first who implemented something like that because even the Moog/Lab Series amps dating back to 1978 have tone shaping features like semiparametric EQ, passive & active tone stacks and variable resonance filters. This is more sophisticated than many amps that are produced today but features like that never took off because a general industry viewpoint seems to be that most guitarists are overwhelmed by anything that's not a TMB tone stack and has more than 5 or 6 knobs per channel.
rottingcorpse
Well-known member
Darrell and Vince grew up in a recording studio.
His first amp was a Yamaha studio 100 combo that he banged the mids in the front with the blue MXR.
You get way more from tweaking the tone with the rack furman peq in the loop than you do up front.
Now...having grown up in a studio,do you really think he would use 2 different types of eqs up front?
Banging the mids on the guitars signal then cutting them right afterwards before the signal even hit the amp?
That's why I'm always surprised when people think he used 2 different kinds of eqs up front.
You bang the mids up front to boost the guitar signal and tighten the amp.
Then tweak and refine them (read as scoop and sizzle) after the tone stack before it hits the power section.
Then stomp on the crybaby when going for the Dimebag trademark whammy bar squeelies. (another not so secret sauce)
There will be others that INSIST otherwise. Maybe I'm blowing smoke up your butt.
Maybe I never met anyone in Pantera ever in my life. Who knows? Who cares? Why bother?
But if you just think about it scientifically....
TheGreatGreen
Well-known member
Totally agree on all points. Something like a Boss GE-7 can be used in a way similar to how most people use boost pedals these days, but with the added benefit of allowing you to specifically shape the low end filtering for you setup instead of just using a tubescreamer or whatever and hoping it will shave off the exact right amount of low end.
To your point about built-in low end filtering in amps, I think this is why I personally get along with Dual Rectos so well. They have almost no low end preamp filtering, so with a good EQ at the input you truly can shape just about any kind of gain characteristics you want with it. And yep I'd love for more amps to include input gain filtering options and more complex post EQ options than a simple TMB tonestack, but like you said apparently that would be too much for most players lol. Personally speaking I basically always have an EQ in the loop of my amps because I think most outboard EQs just have a better command of the right frequencies to adjust. But a huge number of guitar players won't even look twice at something like a Mesa Mark, because each channel has "two EQ sections." I've heard quite a few players joke that you need a degree to figure it out, or that it's "like an airplane cockpit," etc.
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demondestroyer
Well-known member
Thank you for the super informative glimpse into Darrells world. I am a dime fanatic, he was my hero. To me he is the greatest metal guitarist and character in music history. Never got to meet him but can genuinely say I love the dude!
RaceU4her
Well-known member
It should be a rule every guitar player has an EQ if you ask me 
I usually wait outside to greet auditioning guitar players as they pull up, not as like a friendly greeting but more to figure out if they have an eq pedal because if they don’t there’s no reason to even unpack their shit. A few have gotten a little tender with the “my $$$$ amp don’t need an eq pedal” when you know they haven’t even tried one. I say it was nice to meet you and good luck on your band search
I usually wait outside to greet auditioning guitar players as they pull up, not as like a friendly greeting but more to figure out if they have an eq pedal because if they don’t there’s no reason to even unpack their shit. A few have gotten a little tender with the “my $$$$ amp don’t need an eq pedal” when you know they haven’t even tried one. I say it was nice to meet you and good luck on your band search
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inyarak74
Well-known member
? fucking perfect corpse!
RaceU4her
Well-known member
It gives me no joy to say I’ve learned a lot of things the hard way in my many band experiences, most of them now I look back and they are hilarious and I should probably write some screen plays.
RaceU4her
Well-known member
Really, to me not boosting/eq is like spending $75k on whatever new muscle car and not spending the extra couple grand on tires and exhaust to get it to its full potential. Yeah, you might think it’s fine and not spend anymore money but for next to nothing in the end you can get that much more out of it
J
jeff5
Active member
I think it is an essential tone shaping tool, even with amps like Mesa Marks with EQs on board.
Regarding the EQ on Mesa Mark amps, I don't really view or use these like an EQ pedal, mainly due to the design of the Marks and how the actual EQ knobs work. Instead, I use the on board EQ more like the EQ knobs on an other amps. And I agree that the Mesa EQ pedal sounds nothing tonally like the on board Mesa Mark EQ.
Regarding the EQ on Mesa Mark amps, I don't really view or use these like an EQ pedal, mainly due to the design of the Marks and how the actual EQ knobs work. Instead, I use the on board EQ more like the EQ knobs on an other amps. And I agree that the Mesa EQ pedal sounds nothing tonally like the on board Mesa Mark EQ.
rottingcorpse
Well-known member
If I remember right,it was for sale in the classifieds at one point.
I wanted it so bad back then. A real unique piece of kit.
TheGreatGreen
Well-known member
It should be a rule every guitar player has an EQ if you ask me
hahaha this is amazing