Floyd Eye
Well-known member
Benefits for Europe. And my whole point is that Nam and Korea weren't good for the US. We aren't the world police. Let these people fight their own wars.
jdel77
Well-known member
No, not at all.
America only got involved in WW2 because the Japanese compromised your naval Empire in the Pacific.
The Nazi threat in France moving East to Berlin was well done.
In the West, the Russians had already broken the Nazi’s after Stalingrad, so they won that half of the European theatre.
I don’t assume America needs to take care of this problem, but I do expect you to at least fulfill your responsibilities as per the UN and NATO, otherwise get the fuck out of those agreements. And at the same time, get out of Gaza, Syria, Iraq, the Pacific etc… You’re either in, or out.
jdel77
Well-known member
That’s my point mate.
The USA is more than happy to get the dollars it wants from Afghanistan, Gaza, the Pacific etc… but doesn’t want the moral responsibility required to stay in NATO and UN agreements.
If I was an American I’d be disgusted with my country for sending young people to die in military conflicts to secure the Middle Eastern oil trade and the European mineral resources trade.
V
VonBonfire
Well-known member
I mean maybe. The US basically IS the UN and the piggybank and the arms producer for it all. So when we're out, europe has a bigger problem than we do. People are tired of orgs like the UN taking advantage of our tax money without our interests as a priority. It's over Johnny.
DanTravis62
Moderator
Christ who made you a Rig-Talk moderator
You gonna have a personal crack at me then I’ll return serve, you fucking wanker.
If you can’t see that Trump and his little mutt Vance are essentially inviting Putin to reform the Eastern Bloc MKII then you’re a stupid fool.
If you’ve got family who served in WWII or any Cold War conflict then you should be aware of what that means.
"Inviting Putin to create the Eastern block ii"
Is that the best reason you can actually come up with to send hundreds of billions of Americans dollars and potentially millions of lives? Seriously
jdel77
Well-known member
"Inviting Putin to create the Eastern block ii"
Is that the best reason you can actually come up with to send hundreds of billions of Americans dollars and potentially millions of lives? Seriously
Once again, tell me how well Korea, Cuba, Vietnam, Afghanistan, Syria etc… worked out for you guys.
You do know what a proxy war is, don’t you?
DanTravis62
Moderator
Once again, tell me how well Korea, Cuba, Vietnam, Afghanistan, Syria etc… worked out for you guys.
You do know what a proxy war is, don’t you?
So.... you're telling us to stay involved in a proxy war, because previous proxy wars "didn't turn out well"
Do you understand how completely fucking stupid you sound, man?
jdel77
Well-known member
Fair call.
Quit your responsibilities to those agreements, but don’t try to keep your fingers in those pies for the money that rolls in from the oil, gas and mineral trades.
America may as well go in and invade then like Russia has.
jdel77
Well-known member
Dear Lord. No, being involved in proxy wars did not benefit America. It cost you trillions in taxes and lives in your armed forces.
I’m saying that America shouldn’t pretend it gives a shit by signing up to NATO and the UN, and then rape Palestine and Ukraine by handing them over to Israel and Russia to secure the minerals and oil trade.
Quit your international agreements as you clearly can’t live by the responsibilities therein.
DanTravis62
Moderator
uh, yeah, dude. That's the point.
"pretend it gives a shit" LOL WE DON'T GIVE A SHIT. The piggy bank is closed!
DanTravis62
Moderator
Also i love the phrase "living up to our international agreements"
Ah yes, those agreements that US citizens GET NOTHING out of and cost us LITERALLY TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS and the entire rest of the world uses as basically welfare. No shit, the rest of the world would like us to continue to "agree" to give them fucking money. Jesus Christ lol
Ah yes, those agreements that US citizens GET NOTHING out of and cost us LITERALLY TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS and the entire rest of the world uses as basically welfare. No shit, the rest of the world would like us to continue to "agree" to give them fucking money. Jesus Christ lol
Floyd Eye
Well-known member
Minerals and oil ? In Gaza ? Israel wouldn't have been there at all except they didn't care much for the Gazans killing 1200 of their people and taking another 250 hostage.
Come on dude. There is a parallel here though between Ukraine and Gaza. Both Israel and Russia want buffers.
DanTravis62
Moderator
I swear, commonwealthers when it comes to US foreign policy are never 1/10th as informed as they pretend to be
I think to myself "most americans are stupid", then I listen to a canadian or australian talk about the UN, and I am immediately reminded we don't have it so bad
J
jb44
Well-known member
Zelenskiy suffers from little man Napoleon syndrome. Because he could't keep his ego in check, he just condemned more Ukranians to their unnecessary deaths by not signing the deal. Zelenskiy's body language of crossing his arms & not making eye contact is a defensive posture. He's acting on his emotions & pouting like a brat who didn't get his way. Unfortunately, for him & the Ukrainians the forthcoming life lessons will be unpleasant.
Trump was accurate in saying Ukraine doesn't have much, if at all, "peace" negotiations leverage. Trump could have been less belligerent/forceful in his delivery towards Zelinskiy.
JD Vance should have just STFU, not interjected, & just listened. It wasn't Vance's place to tell how Zelenskiy should be more grateful for the U.S.A.'s
help & it was a baseless assumption on Vance's part. For someone who likely has presidential aspirations, Vance should have just taken in as much as he could to learn how to approach/handle future geopolitical negotiations.
Zelenskiy saying Putin won't uphold his end of of the peace agreement is an obvious no brainer. What Zelenskiy didn't see in signing an agreement with the U.S., with regards to "minerals" access, is that this would allow for U.S. military presence into the Ukraine to protect American "economic interests" in the Ukrainian regions. The U.S. military presence would act as a deterrent to mitigate (military) shenanigans from Putin/Russia.
If there are valuable minerals, this would bring economic prosperity & stability to Ukraine, helping the country & its people rebuild. I would speculate that if there are rare-earth metals in the Ukraine, part of the agreement would include some sort of back-door kickback to Russia for them not to disrupt. Economically, it's a win for all 3 countries.
Those vilifying Trump for making deals with Putin obviously don't know U.S. history. FDR negotiated Stalin who killed at least 20M of his own people. Nixon dealt with Mao Zedong, the worst of the 20th C mass murderers, with upwards of 65M Chinese casualties. Putin is an amateur compared to Stalin or Mao. If those 2 U.S. presidents didn't geopolitically negotiate with the totalitarians, far more Russians/Chinese would have been killed.
Trump is following Sun Tzu's Art of War in dealing with Putin.
Edit: I forgot. For those paying attention, Zelinkskiy was elected to a 5-year term as the Ukrainian president which officially ended in May 2024. What did Zelinskiy do to remain Ukraine's "president"?
Trump was accurate in saying Ukraine doesn't have much, if at all, "peace" negotiations leverage. Trump could have been less belligerent/forceful in his delivery towards Zelinskiy.
JD Vance should have just STFU, not interjected, & just listened. It wasn't Vance's place to tell how Zelenskiy should be more grateful for the U.S.A.'s
help & it was a baseless assumption on Vance's part. For someone who likely has presidential aspirations, Vance should have just taken in as much as he could to learn how to approach/handle future geopolitical negotiations.
Zelenskiy saying Putin won't uphold his end of of the peace agreement is an obvious no brainer. What Zelenskiy didn't see in signing an agreement with the U.S., with regards to "minerals" access, is that this would allow for U.S. military presence into the Ukraine to protect American "economic interests" in the Ukrainian regions. The U.S. military presence would act as a deterrent to mitigate (military) shenanigans from Putin/Russia.
If there are valuable minerals, this would bring economic prosperity & stability to Ukraine, helping the country & its people rebuild. I would speculate that if there are rare-earth metals in the Ukraine, part of the agreement would include some sort of back-door kickback to Russia for them not to disrupt. Economically, it's a win for all 3 countries.
Those vilifying Trump for making deals with Putin obviously don't know U.S. history. FDR negotiated Stalin who killed at least 20M of his own people. Nixon dealt with Mao Zedong, the worst of the 20th C mass murderers, with upwards of 65M Chinese casualties. Putin is an amateur compared to Stalin or Mao. If those 2 U.S. presidents didn't geopolitically negotiate with the totalitarians, far more Russians/Chinese would have been killed.
Trump is following Sun Tzu's Art of War in dealing with Putin.
Sun Tzu said:
Edit: I forgot. For those paying attention, Zelinkskiy was elected to a 5-year term as the Ukrainian president which officially ended in May 2024. What did Zelinskiy do to remain Ukraine's "president"?
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Wizard of Ozz
Well-known member
You have no clue what you are talking about. Dealt with... Please.
The forum knows you are a commie that loves getting vaxed almost as much as a warm kielbasa.
You can't answer the questions:
How much money has Australia sent to Ukraine?
How much in weapons, ammo, and material has Australia sent?
I'll be waiting for that answer. Maybe your husband can help you look it up.
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Thumbpicker
Well-known member
Here's a link so you Yanks can learn your new mother tongue: Russian www.duolingo.com
The~Kid
Well-known member
Also totally agree here. I mean when are they going to start defending themselves....... never......
America can't do it forever, I mean they are allies but in general it's not 1945 anymore it's 2025. Also say even Russia wins....... Given the history between Ukraine and Russia I don't see how they could maintain any real peace occupying Ukraine...... much like in Afghanistan only worse.
I mean IMO America should be more forceful as it should have been when Russia took Crimea under Obama...... then Syria and the use of Chemical weapons with no repercussions..... then the Ukraine War...... appeasement doesnt work and this is the lesson to take from Putin and the Russians will just keep doing what they do if they aren't met with steel on the other side of the doors they try to open.......
Pretty much it's just up to the Europeans now to figure it out because for better or worse America is out.
The~Kid
Well-known member
As said and right on cue...... and projected ahead of time before it actually happened.....
The British are the first to support Ukraine and the French and Germans won't be far behind either.......
shar-vell Dan
Well-known member
V
VonBonfire
Well-known member
I'm looking forward to working with Russia to develop infrastructure to access vast natural resources. As allies we can raise most of the world to 2nd and 1st world status.