Boogie JP2C (Coming Back)

[VC4Ever]

That anybody is chastising the OP because his brand new, made in the US amp has a loop that acts fucky under common usage conditions is utterly fucky in ways I can't articulate. I'd be pissed, too. $2500 is hardly a budget amp. It had better work properly. And this from a company that's been making amps for how long now? Whether it's just his amp or a problem common to the line isn't the issue. If it were me, that it happened to my amp would be the only issue that matters. That they want him to pay shipping both ways is a travesty. I wonder if they call it a "feature" like the old recto manual claims the presence on orange affecting the sound when you're on the red channel is a "cool feature. " Translated: a design flaw The Tone Farm spun as a planned aspect of the amp.

No amp I've ever owned has done this while using the loop. Not my poor man evh, my powerball, my splawn, or even my cheap ass B-52 when I'd owned one.

They shouldn't make you pay for shipping, man. That's Fucked up.

Well you're obviously very ARTICULATE brooooooooooo

 

[shreder75]

That anybody is chastising the OP because his brand new, made in the US amp has a loop that acts fucky under common usage conditions is utterly fucky in ways I can't articulate. I'd be pissed, too. $2500 is hardly a budget amp. It had better work properly. And this from a company that's been making amps for how long now? Whether it's just his amp or a problem common to the line isn't the issue. If it were me, that it happened to my amp would be the only issue that matters. That they want him to pay shipping both ways is a travesty. I wonder if they call it a "feature" like the old recto manual claims the presence on orange affecting the sound when you're on the red channel is a "cool feature. " Translated: a design flaw The Tone Farm spun as a planned aspect of the amp.

No amp I've ever owned has done this while using the loop. Not my poor man evh, my powerball, my splawn, or even my cheap ass B-52 when I'd owned one.

They shouldn't make you pay for shipping, man. That's Fucked up.

Well you're obviously very ARTICULATE brooooooooooo

Clearly, I spoke too soon

 

[NewWorldMan]

I wonder if they call it a "feature" like the old recto manual claims the presence on orange affecting the sound when you're on the red channel is a "cool feature. " Translated: a design flaw The Tone Farm spun as a planned aspect of the amp...

That's actually one of my favorite tones on the older 2 channel Rectos... Cloning the modern channel to vintage and then using the dual Presence controls to fine tune the high end.

As far as shipping goes, every site I've seen has free shipping on this head. Where in the world was it purchased that shipping had to be paid up front? As far as shipping it back, it is what it is. Shipping wasn't (or shouldn't have been) paid to begin with. I suppose the store is supposed to just cut a check? C'mon people, were pushing it here. If you don't want to worry about shipping costs, buy local.

 

[Superunknown]

I wonder if they call it a "feature" like the old recto manual claims the presence on orange affecting the sound when you're on the red channel is a "cool feature. " Translated: a design flaw The Tone Farm spun as a planned aspect of the amp...

That's actually one of my favorite tones on the older 2 channel Rectos... Cloning the modern channel to vintage and then using the dual Presence controls to fine tune the high end.

As far as shipping goes, every site I've seen has free shipping on this head. Where in the world was it purchased that shipping had to be paid up front? As far as shipping it back, it is what it is. Shipping wasn't (or shouldn't have been) paid to begin with. I suppose the store is supposed to just cut a check? C'mon people, were pushing it here. If you don't want to worry about shipping costs, buy local.

Initial shipping was free from Mesa Hollywood. When you return an amp, you are responsible for the cost of return shipping and insurance. In addition, when you return an amp, Mesa Hollywood also charges for their initial shipping to you once the amp is returned.

 

[Speeddemon]

Delay spillover is a big deal
Over here..ymmv.

Help me understand this. You're an SLO 100 owner. The SLO is a 2 channel amp with little to no options, where one of those channels (clean) is mediocre at best (and horrible, IMO, by comparison to amps like the JP-2C) and had a loop deemed by most as completely unusable with things like delay because of the circuit.

So, that's $4200 for a stripped down platform where the loop is an even bigger issue overall, and that's cool to buy and own and ask people to pay 70% more than an amp with 3 independent channels, a far superior clean channel, midi control built in, lots of switching options, dual graphic EQs, reverb, built in cab simulator, etc...with a loop that sounds great and only gives a volume bump on the initial repeats of a delayed signal if switching from dirty to clean while repeating?

I'm not seeing the logic here. For the same amount of money that the one trick pony amp (SLO) with the same issue but worse costs, someone could buy a damn full JP-2C half stack, BOSS ES-8 switcher, and some pedals to go on it...if not 2 JP-2C's entirely for not much more.

Not criticizing at all, I honestly want to understand the rationale here, because I don't see it.

I wonder if the folks that complain about the volume jump of the EVH 50W are also o.k with this JP-2C behaviour.
Heck, I think the same designer-logic (whether it be H. Kaplan or R. Smith) applies there; wanna keep the blue channel as 'brown' as possible while still having a 3 channel amp with a clean channel, well, then something will 'suffer'...

I have my work-around for that (gain at 6/10 and use push-pull pots to split humbuckers to get the Green channel really clean), FWIW.

 

[NewWorldMan]

Initial shipping was free from Mesa Hollywood. When you return an amp, you are responsible for the cost of return shipping and insurance. In addition, when you return an amp, Mesa Hollywood also charges for their initial shipping to you once the amp is returned.

Return shipping I get - it's a buyers responsibility. I think I'd call and argue about a retroactive shipping charge for the initial shipment. That's not exactly "free shipping". I'd venture to say it's probably well spelled out in the terms (which no one reads), but I'd still call and argue about it.

 

[shreder75]

Delay spillover is a big deal
Over here..ymmv.

Help me understand this. You're an SLO 100 owner. The SLO is a 2 channel amp with little to no options, where one of those channels (clean) is mediocre at best (and horrible, IMO, by comparison to amps like the JP-2C) and had a loop deemed by most as completely unusable with things like delay because of the circuit.

So, that's $4200 for a stripped down platform where the loop is an even bigger issue overall, and that's cool to buy and own and ask people to pay 70% more than an amp with 3 independent channels, a far superior clean channel, midi control built in, lots of switching options, dual graphic EQs, reverb, built in cab simulator, etc...with a loop that sounds great and only gives a volume bump on the initial repeats of a delayed signal if switching from dirty to clean while repeating?

I'm not seeing the logic here. For the same amount of money that the one trick pony amp (SLO) with the same issue but worse costs, someone could buy a damn full JP-2C half stack, BOSS ES-8 switcher, and some pedals to go on it...if not 2 JP-2C's entirely for not much more.

Not criticizing at all, I honestly want to understand the rationale here, because I don't see it.

I wonder if the folks that complain about the volume jump of the EVH 50W are also o.k with this JP-2C behaviour.
Heck, I think the same designer-logic (whether it be H. Kaplan or R. Smith) applies there; wanna keep the blue channel as 'brown' as possible while still having a 3 channel amp with a clean channel, well, then something will 'suffer'...

I have my work-around for that (gain at 6/10 and use push-pull pots to split humbuckers to get the Green channel really clean), FWIW.

That's not apples to apples. The issue in the op vid is a huge volume swell that tapers off after a time. It's a massive spike, not a slight volume imbalance between a clean and dirty.

 

[Superunknown]

Initial shipping was free from Mesa Hollywood. When you return an amp, you are responsible for the cost of return shipping and insurance. In addition, when you return an amp, Mesa Hollywood also charges for their initial shipping to you once the amp is returned.

Return shipping I get - it's a buyers responsibility. I think I'd call and argue about a retroactive shipping charge for the initial shipment. That's not exactly "free shipping". I'd venture to say it's probably well spelled out in the terms (which no one reads), but I'd still call and argue about it.

You are correct, those are in fact the terms. Lesson learned....onward and upward!

 

[VC4Ever]

Always try and read the polices and conditions. But no one ever does.

 

[ElectricVoodoo]

The JP2C sounds great imo.
I will however, stick with my trusty EVH 5153 50 with a great loop btw.

The EVH 5153 50 is simply and all around workhorse rock/metal monster that continues to deliver.

Maybe if the JP2C finds a factory mod as stated above for the loop spillover, then maybe.. just maybe, it will be a far contender to the EVH 5153 50.

 

[glip22]

The JP2C sounds great imo.
I will however, stick with my trusty EVH 5153 50 with a great loop btw.

The EVH 5153 50 is simply and all around workhorse rock/metal monster that continues to deliver.

Maybe if the JP2C finds a factory mod as stated above for the loop spillover, then maybe.. just maybe, it will be a far contender to the EVH 5153 50.

You keep drinking that Kool Aide I wish I could drink a few glasses and not spend any more loot. If it's not this then it's that.

 

[Candiria]

They shouldn't make you pay for shipping, man. That's Fucked up.

I have a PRS that I bought from Sweetwater that may or may not be defective. I have to pay to ship it to them for them to look at, and pay for them to ship it back to me when they're done even if it is defective. You buy something from guitar center and don't have a local store to return it to, you pay return shipping, and you don't get refunded the initial shipping. Same thing goes for Amazon, and probably many more major retailers. It's lame as hell.

The JP2C sounds great imo.
I will however, stick with my trusty EVH 5153 50 with a great loop btw.

The EVH 5153 50 is simply and all around workhorse rock/metal monster that continues to deliver.

Maybe if the JP2C finds a factory mod as stated above for the loop spillover, then maybe.. just maybe, it will be a far contender to the EVH 5153 50.

That's the one that would heat up, start smoking, and then die when they first came out right. Or is that the one with the volume jump from channel 1 to channel 2 that forced people to start using a processor in the loop in order to have a true clean channel

That's a good example of something people flipped out over when an amp first came out, but now no one ever thinks about.

 

[VC4Ever]

superunknown, I noticed in the video all your master volumes are at 0. Are you bypassing the master volume? Maybe try the amp with the master volume engaged?

 

[VC4Ever]

I'm just reading this from the manual. There is a lot to absorb from the manual which may help resolve some issues. Here's a tidbit.

"Unlike many other MESA amplifiers where the Channel MASTER also acts as an EFFECTS SEND control, the JP-2C required a
different layout to ensure the authenticity of the MARK II-C+ circuit. Here Channel 1 uses that scheme (Channel MASTER doubling
as a SEND Level control), but the two high gain Channels (2 and 3) see the GAIN control doubling as the EFFECTS SEND control.
The reason for this has to do with the fact that it is really the LEAD DRIVE control on a MARK II-C+, which WAS responsible for the
SEND strength in a II-C+. Regardless, despite this difference in both origination of the signal and control placement, the Channels
balance out quite nicely and you should have no problem with signal levels at your processor(s)."

 

[shreder75]

The JP2C sounds great imo.
I will however, stick with my trusty EVH 5153 50 with a great loop btw.

The EVH 5153 50 is simply and all around workhorse rock/metal monster that continues to deliver.

Maybe if the JP2C finds a factory mod as stated above for the loop spillover, then maybe.. just maybe, it will be a far contender to the EVH 5153 50.

You need to buy some better amps. I'm saying that as a friend.

Oh, brother

 

[RJF]

I can't believe people's attitudes sometimes......

For over a decade people have been wanting a reissue C+..... they get one that apparently sounds really close and is a totally feature loaded amp that appears to be far from a one trick pony, and with midi very rig friendly.

One small problem and people have a fit that Mesa doesn't have a fix, with an amp that hasn't been on the market for one week yet. Yes, Rez, that was mainly directed at you. I'm sure Mike Soldano took muuuucccchhhh longer than a week to fix the crappy loop in his SLO.

As far as shipping, I get the charges. The buyer chose to return it. It's not a warranty claim, he simply just wanted to return it. Why should the dealer get stuck paying the shipping when the customer decides they changed their mind?

Problems are inherent with new designs. It happens every day. Ever bought a new car and later got a recall notice? I know people that bought a brand new ( 1st year completely new design) John Deere combine for $400K. Problems surfaced with the new design as the machine aged, customer got stuck paying $50K for updates to fix the factory flaws with the original design. Did it suck? Yep, but beats beating grain against a rock to harvest it.

Don't want a single problem with a complex piece of equipment like a tube guitar amp? Go full acoustic, not much to go wrong there.

I'm sure that over time Mesa will come up with a solution to this problem.

 

[NewWorldMan]

I'm just reading this from the manual. There is a lot to absorb from the manual which may help resolve some issues. Here's a tidbit.

"Unlike many other MESA amplifiers where the Channel MASTER also acts as an EFFECTS SEND control, the JP-2C required a
different layout to ensure the authenticity of the MARK II-C+ circuit. Here Channel 1 uses that scheme (Channel MASTER doubling
as a SEND Level control), but the two high gain Channels (2 and 3) see the GAIN control doubling as the EFFECTS SEND control.
The reason for this has to do with the fact that it is really the LEAD DRIVE control on a MARK II-C+, which WAS responsible for the
SEND strength in a II-C+. Regardless, despite this difference in both origination of the signal and control placement, the Channels
balance out quite nicely and you should have no problem with signal levels at your processor(s)."

This goes back to what I said earlier about the amp being played with the volume practically off. Yes, that's how the original IIC+ operated. I can already see why they did it (wanted the drive channels to be exactly like the IIC+ circuit, where as most people will probably run the gain control on the clean really low and it would diminish the level send to the effects).

This explains why that clip posted with the gain cranked up to around 3:00 on the dirty channel pushed the signal so much onto the clean channel when switched (because the send there - which is the clean volume - was practically running at "0" or whisper volume).

 

[midnightlaundry]

I'm just reading this from the manual. There is a lot to absorb from the manual which may help resolve some issues. Here's a tidbit.

"Unlike many other MESA amplifiers where the Channel MASTER also acts as an EFFECTS SEND control, the JP-2C required a
different layout to ensure the authenticity of the MARK II-C+ circuit. Here Channel 1 uses that scheme (Channel MASTER doubling
as a SEND Level control), but the two high gain Channels (2 and 3) see the GAIN control doubling as the EFFECTS SEND control.
The reason for this has to do with the fact that it is really the LEAD DRIVE control on a MARK II-C+, which WAS responsible for the
SEND strength in a II-C+. Regardless, despite this difference in both origination of the signal and control placement, the Channels
balance out quite nicely and you should have no problem with signal levels at your processor(s)."

This brings up a great point.. The Mark V loop is funny too. At a bedroom volume my MPX-1 will sould like it's in a garbage can. But when the levels are at a volume in which the amp was designed, the Lexicon sounds great because it's getting the signal levels that IT was designed for.. Lol



I bet the JP2C is fine at a band volume.

 

[Racerxrated]

Hey Todd, thanks for posting. Shit move for someone to call you out in any way for anything. Your amp, review and decision. Wow.

 

[Chris6870]

So much for any more cheap mark 5's.

I scooped one up yesterday.