Bugera TriRec Vs. Mesa Dual Recto (Video)

[billboogie]

 

[fluff191]

Yup. all good.

'Murica!

Fluff, by the way, sorry for derailing your thread. Thanks for putting those clips up. I'll stop deviating now.

Thanks.

No, no its all good man. Discussion is GOOD. This is a forum afterall. Thanks for feeling like you could comment.

 

[billboogie]

+1 Fluff

 

[Ricky Rockhardo]

I think we can all agree that Fluff has the toanz and skills.
Well done! I have always like how your palm mutes come out.


Regarding the whole international trade debate, since when was it bad
for one country to specialize in cheap quality mass produced products
And another to specialize in "hand made" high quality products.
Its all comparative advantage and its all welfare improving!!

 

[Ricky Rockhardo]

+1 Fluff

And this!

 

[borninwinter]

I think we can all agree that Fluff has the toanz and skills.
Well done! I have always like how your palm mutes come out.

Yep.

 

[TheMagicEight]

I wouldn't call taking a Marshall circuit and tweaking it a "new design." And if they did it "for the sake of design" why aren't they giving their amps and mods away for free? Also, for people that don't have as much money as you do, lowering the price is an improvement - just not the improvement you're looking for...

I don't have much money. That's why I build my own gear.

As for "for the sake of design", you missed the point. The reason a Bogner is on the market is because it's a great design. A Bugera is on the market because people are too cheap to pay for quality / human rights.

I assume that your computer, phone, TV, DVD player, clothes, car, and appliances are not made in China or using Chinese parts.

Any opportunity I have to avoid products made in countries whose governments disrespect human rights or the environment on the level of China's, I avoid. As none of the products you mentioned are available without Chinese parts, it's unavoidable that I've bought them from China.

haha so what is this about then? Are we talking politics or amp design? If Soldano, Bogner and Splawn arent exact copies then neither is Bugera in this instance. The Recto doesnt have individual channel reverb, power soak, built-in boost or per-tube auto bias.

I bet you are wearing Nike's right now, huh?

It's a good point about the Bugera's features. And I suppose it's also true that the 5150 and Rectifier are just barely-modded SLOs. But then why call it the Tri Rec? My argument is the Bugera is meant to be a cheap Rectifier clone with a few additional features. I don't think you could say the same of Bogner and Marshall. Especially when looking at it from the perspective of price.

Yes, I have Nike's. But again, where's the alternative? What choice do I have? I'm not saying there isn't one - maybe I'll learn something - but it's pretty obvious with Mesa / Bugera.

The heart of the issue for me is that there are two options. Option one is to buy the Mesa, which is reliable and supports the USA. Option two is to buy the Bugera, which saves you money and gets you a few extra (useful) features. But if you buy the Bugera for cheapness, you're only hurting the USA more. And if you buy it for its features, well, good luck having it last, because I'd be willing to bet everything in there is the lowest quality available. Therefore, I see it as pointless and anyone who purchases one as short sighted.

If you disagree with me, fair enough. Maybe you know something I don't.

 

[blackba]

I feel like I have read the same arguments for and against Behringer/Bugera a thousand times.

Anyway, thanks for making the clip fluff. It was cool to see them run head to head.

 

[TheMagicEight]

I feel like I have read the same arguments for and against Behringer/Bugera a thousand times.

Anyway, thanks for making the clip fluff. It was cool to see them run head to head.

Yeah, well, you know how it goes....

 

[Sick Michael]

Bugera.

The brighter tone just seems to sit a little better in the mix. Could probably dial in both amps to sound pretty similar though, Id imagine.

Nice work!

 

[borninwinter]

I feel like I have read the same arguments for and against Behringer/Bugera a thousand times.

Anyway, thanks for making the clip fluff. It was cool to see them run head to head.

Yeah, well, you know how it goes....

Yeah I think what can be said has been said. Really, I'll all for you buying the amp you like for whatever reasons make you happy and have never thought about Bugera one way or the other before this thread. I just don't think there's any amp out there that doesn't use some Chinese parts, so at the end of the day I really don't feel like you're either harming or benefiting the US/the economy/the environment/whatever either way you go with your choice of amp. Personally, I'm not one that feels like every action I take should be a statement, so I just bought the amp that gave me the sound I like best and left it at that.

 

[TheMagicEight]

at the end of the day I really don't feel like you're either harming or benefiting the US/the economy/the environment/whatever either way you go with your choice of amp. Personally, I'm not one that feels like every action I take should be a statement, so I just bought the amp that gave me the sound I like best and left it at that.

Going to have to disagree with you here, but

Yeah I think what can be said has been said. Really, I'll all for you buying the amp you like for whatever reasons make you happy

Agree here and ready to move forward.

 

[Mailman1971]

[No message]

 

[borninwinter]

That kid makes a persuasive argument...

 

[Mailman1971]

That kid makes a persuasive argument...

That kid has made more appearances In Rig talk threads.....he is legendary.

 

[JCDenton6]

Remember that Fluff is a recto guy as well.
Well done on the video!

 

[metalmaniac93]

You don't see Mesa or any of the other contemporary builders taking an amp design and putting their name on it. That's not how Mesa started and there's really no comparison. They make something unique. They're INNOVATORS. There's a big difference.
.

So Splawn, Freidman, Soldano and those kinds of companies are original? And you are going to tell me those designs are totally original?

It blows my mind you guys get so defensive about a company like Bugera but a company like Ceriatone that's sells exact copies of amps as a kit are just fine.

Seems to me there is a huge double standard here. Maybe if they charged a load more money and said they were based in America it would be ok right?

Just want to chime and say I agree with all of the logic you've put forth in this thread. Furthermore, in the interest of a free market and capitalism, as Japan did 30-40 years ago, maybe China can do now: put forth a level of quality that forces American manufacturers to reconsider how they do things, and attain higher quality principles (in the quantitative sense) than what we achieve now. Deming's work in Japan changed the game...

But I digress. I'd have to ask a few questions for those of you deriding the fact that Bugera makes their product in China:

1) Do you own a vehicle? If so, where was it made? What country is the manufacturer from?
2) Do you drink beer? Is it all local craft beer? Because if it's standard macro, you're either supporting Belgium/Brazil (All Anheuser-Busch Inbev products), England (SABMiller, Diageo, Guinness), Canada (Molson Coors), etc. If you drink wine, is it all US wine? Liquor all US liquor (keep in mind that, excepting small scale distillers, the only booze of real quality in made in this country is Kentucky and Tennessee Whiskey).
3) Are all of your guitars American made? Amps? Own a Ceriatone or GAS for one? Own a Marshall? The first Marshall amps were copies of Fender amps, remember? How about a Diezel or Engl?

You don't literally have to answer those questions. But there's a point I'm trying to get across. We live in a global economy with global competition. It's not like Mesa is doing badly. Bugera's target market isn't going to buy Mesa in the first place. It's mainly for either the international market or the beginner/intermediate budget market here. In fact, Mesa isn't the company that should be worried. Peavey is. And let's not forget that the XXX, down to the looks, was supposed to be a Recto knockoff, so this is a taste of their own medicine.

People just aren't going to proudly use Bugera anytime, if ever instead of a Mesa. The only thing I could concievably see happening is, like the parent company has done with it's pro audio side, you could see Behringer buy out another more heralded guitar amp manufacturer and start using their schematics, parts, what have you. They bought Midas not too long ago and came out with a very highly regarded digital board, the X32. Anyone who does live sound knows Midas is top notch... and lots of engineers are GASsing for this board, but musicians haven't caught up yet. They see Behringer on the gear list and they get worried, especially when it's such an integral part of the rig like the console. But it's a really good sounding, good functioning board.

When the US starts making better beer than Belgium then I will start drinking American!!! I actually drink American craft beers most of the time and also Belgian and German beers. Guinness is Irish by the way!!! Nothing better than Belgian Trappist beer!!!

Speaking as a member of the American craft beer community, I think Americans have gotten down the Belgian styles pretty well. Goose Island, Ommegang, Bruery, etc., put out amazing products though, ironically, Goose Island is now Belgian owned.

And Guiness is owned by Diageo, therefore it's English. Sorry to burst that bubble. So is Smithwick's, by the way.

Sorry to burst your bubble they have not duplicated the finest Belgian beers!!Goose Island is not very good IMO.. Ommegang good stuff and close but not close enough. Bruery is really good though. So what if Guinness it is owned by an English company. It is still Irish and Budweiser/AB is still American crap owned by Inbev. When did GI get bought?

I have been drinking Belgian beers for quite a while as well as American craft beer and I currently live in Brussels and trust me, there is no comparison in between most Belgian beers and American craft brews as far as the Belgian style beers.

 

[Mailman1971]

Back on track.....
Love Fluff's Videos.....No matter what amps he is playing. Guy rocks!

 

[fluff191]

 

[steve_k]

I wouldn't call taking a Marshall circuit and tweaking it a "new design." And if they did it "for the sake of design" why aren't they giving their amps and mods away for free? Also, for people that don't have as much money as you do, lowering the price is an improvement - just not the improvement you're looking for...

I don't have much money. That's why I build my own gear.

As for "for the sake of design", you missed the point. The reason a Bogner is on the market is because it's a great design. A Bugera is on the market because people are too cheap to pay for quality / human rights.

I assume that your computer, phone, TV, DVD player, clothes, car, and appliances are not made in China or using Chinese parts.

Any opportunity I have to avoid products made in countries whose governments disrespect human rights or the environment on the level of China's, I avoid. As none of the products you mentioned are available without Chinese parts, it's unavoidable that I've bought them from China.

haha so what is this about then? Are we talking politics or amp design? If Soldano, Bogner and Splawn arent exact copies then neither is Bugera in this instance. The Recto doesnt have individual channel reverb, power soak, built-in boost or per-tube auto bias.

I bet you are wearing Nike's right now, huh?

It's a good point about the Bugera's features. And I suppose it's also true that the 5150 and Rectifier are just barely-modded SLOs. But then why call it the Tri Rec? My argument is the Bugera is meant to be a cheap Rectifier clone with a few additional features. I don't think you could say the same of Bogner and Marshall. Especially when looking at it from the perspective of price.

Yes, I have Nike's. But again, where's the alternative? What choice do I have? I'm not saying there isn't one - maybe I'll learn something - but it's pretty obvious with Mesa / Bugera.

The heart of the issue for me is that there are two options. Option one is to buy the Mesa, which is reliable and supports the USA. Option two is to buy the Bugera, which saves you money and gets you a few extra (useful) features. But if you buy the Bugera for cheapness, you're only hurting the USA more. And if you buy it for its features, well, good luck having it last, because I'd be willing to bet everything in there is the lowest quality available. Therefore, I see it as pointless and anyone who purchases one as short sighted.

If you disagree with me, fair enough. Maybe you know something I don't.

Good summary and I agree. Stand by your choices and the reasons for them.