Did anyone just see that Obama speech?

[Marshall Freak]

Very well put, and a blind liberal view. My view of God and Christianity has nothing to do with the liberal mindset. I am not going to debate this with you as I can see you have your minimalistic view of this already. Can you say socialism. And I think the Church and people of America should help others, just not let the Government regulate it, everything they touch goes to crap, Can you say Social Security.

Hows supporting others through state regulation a LIBERAL view?

Why is supporting thousands or millions of homeless people minimalistic exactly?

Please, "socialist"? Give me a break, are you a complete idiot? I said that those that cannot provide for themselves should be looked out for, especially in the case of someone with Autism, or Down Syndrome, or Paraplegia - the government should take the moral highground and do that. Becuase, lets face it, not a whole lot of other people would help.

Same goes for the homeless, many of them just need a chance to improve and start again, it's completely immoral to ignore them and lecture them on life choices. I'm sure if there were migating circumstances they regret them, no need to get morally superior to the less fortunate.

The reason your government regulations go to crap is because most of your policies are inefficent and generally just shit in every facet. This isn't to say that having government regulated healthcare, or social security is a bad idea, or impractical - it's not and works very well in dozens of other countries, just that your current models are terrible.

Moral of the story - Get a real government, one that can legislate properly and support those less fortunate - neither of which are BAD ideas.

You need to get a fucking clue about the state of things before you go off on ignorant rants about OUR system.

 

[Ultron]

Very well put, and a blind liberal view. My view of God and Christianity has nothing to do with the liberal mindset. I am not going to debate this with you as I can see you have your minimalistic view of this already. Can you say socialism. And I think the Church and people of America should help others, just not let the Government regulate it, everything they touch goes to crap, Can you say Social Security.

Hows supporting others through state regulation a LIBERAL view?

Why is supporting thousands or millions of homeless people minimalistic exactly?

Please, "socialist"? Give me a break, are you a complete idiot? I said that those that cannot provide for themselves should be looked out for, especially in the case of someone with Autism, or Down Syndrome, or Paraplegia - the government should take the moral highground and do that. Becuase, lets face it, not a whole lot of other people would help.

Same goes for the homeless, many of them just need a chance to improve and start again, it's completely immoral to ignore them and lecture them on life choices. I'm sure if there were migating circumstances they regret them, no need to get morally superior to the less fortunate.

The reason your government regulations go to crap is because most of your policies are inefficent and generally just shit in every facet. This isn't to say that having government regulated healthcare, or social security is a bad idea, or impractical - it's not and works very well in dozens of other countries, just that your current models are terrible.

Moral of the story - Get a real government, one that can legislate properly and support those less fortunate - neither of which are BAD ideas.

You need to get a fucking clue about the state of things before you go off on ignorant rants about OUR system.

care to elaborate more than posting emoticons?

 

[Marshall Freak]

Anyone hear the quote from McCain how he doesn't understand economics? The guy's been in office almost 40 years, and now wants to run for Pres, and doesn't understand economics? That reason alone is why he's not getting my vote.

You actually think Obama understands it either? None of them do, they hire the best equipped out there to help them work it out. At least McCain has the balls to state that he's going to find experts and not just pretend he's God like Obama.

Heard the statement by Obama that he's visited 57 states? Talk about a stupid fuck.

 

[Marshall Freak]

care to elaborate more than posting emoticons?

Why waste my time trying to explain that he's ignorant of facts when he's from Australia and his opinion of our country and policies doesn't mean jack shit to me?

 

[Ultron]

Anyone hear the quote from McCain how he doesn't understand economics? The guy's been in office almost 40 years, and now wants to run for Pres, and doesn't understand economics? That reason alone is why he's not getting my vote.

You actually think Obama understands it either? None of them do, they hire the best equipped out there to help them work it out. At least McCain has the balls to state that he's going to find experts and not just pretend he's God like Obama.

Heard the statement by Obama that he's visited 57 states? Talk about a stupid fuck.

Dude, he's been involved in the economy for almost 40 years....that plainly tells me he's a dumbass.

Instead of telling me why I shouldn't vote for Obama, tell me why I should vote for McCain?

 

[Marshall Freak]

Anyone hear the quote from McCain how he doesn't understand economics? The guy's been in office almost 40 years, and now wants to run for Pres, and doesn't understand economics? That reason alone is why he's not getting my vote.

You actually think Obama understands it either? None of them do, they hire the best equipped out there to help them work it out. At least McCain has the balls to state that he's going to find experts and not just pretend he's God like Obama.

Heard the statement by Obama that he's visited 57 states? Talk about a stupid fuck.

Dude, he's been involved in the economy for almost 40 years....that plainly tells me he's a dumbass.

Instead of telling me why I shouldn't vote for Obama, tell me why I should vote for McCain?

Why? Because I firmly believe Obama's plans for the economy are going to make this downturn we're currently in look like paradise. When we're already paying record prices for food, Gas, Oil, and literally everything else Obama wants to raise taxes at record levels putting even less money in our pockets. What will the Gov do with all that extra money they take from us? They'll wasted it on more huge programs that bloat the government even more and make things look worse. One of the reasons oil is as high as it is right now is because we haven't built a refinery in almost 35 years, plus we won't drill anywhere so we're at the mercy of the people we buy it from. (we only get a small percentage from the middle east) So instead of doing something about it, Obama wants to tax the oil companies even more. Guess who will pay that? Us. If I sell you a guitar for 500 and UPS starts charging me 200 to ship it, You're now paying 700.00 for a guitar. Same with oil.

Universal health care sounds fun, but honestly have you renewed a drivers license or had anything to do with a Government run program lately? I have a USDA loan on my cattle and it takes me nearly 10 times as much work and 20 times as long to get anything done with that loan as it does with a bank. I think the Medical system needs work, but the last thing I want to have to depend on is an enormously bloated bureaucracy when my kid breaks an arm.

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

care to elaborate more than posting emoticons?

Why waste my time trying to explain that he's ignorant of facts when he's from Australia and his opinion of our country and policies doesn't mean jack shit to me?

Maybe if you engaged and asked specifics instead of ignoring me because I live in another country you'd find out I'm not as "ignorant" as you think.

I'm still trying to work out why so many Americans are against giving disabled and homeless people a chance

 

[Marshall Freak]

care to elaborate more than posting emoticons?

Why waste my time trying to explain that he's ignorant of facts when he's from Australia and his opinion of our country and policies doesn't mean jack shit to me?

Maybe if you engaged and asked specifics instead of ignoring me because I live in another country you'd find out I'm not as "ignorant" as you think.

I'm still trying to work out why so many Americans are against giving disabled and homeless people a chance

We're not against it, I'm not sure where you people in other countries get these ideas. There are literally NO starving people in the US. It's the law here, no hospital can deny anyone of service, and there are tons of programs that help disabled people help. Our poorest people that live on Welfare still have cars, Air conditioned homes, TV's,DVD players etc. There are some that slip through the cracks etc, but for the most part all they had to do was ask.

 

[Ultron]

Why? Because I firmly believe Obama's plans for the economy are going to make this downturn we're currently in look like paradise. When we're already paying record prices for food, Gas, Oil, and literally everything else Obama wants to raise taxes at record levels putting even less money in our pockets. What will the Gov do with all that extra money they take from us? They'll wasted it on more huge programs that bloat the government even more and make things look worse. One of the reasons oil is as high as it is right now is because we haven't built a refinery in almost 35 years, plus we won't drill anywhere so we're at the mercy of the people we buy it from. (we only get a small percentage from the middle east) So instead of doing something about it, Obama wants to tax the oil companies even more. Guess who will pay that? Us. If I sell you a guitar for 500 and UPS starts charging me 200 to ship it, You're now paying 700.00 for a guitar. Same with oil.

Universal health care sounds fun, but honestly have you renewed a drivers license or had anything to do with a Government run program lately? I have a USDA loan on my cattle and it takes me nearly 10 times as much work and 20 times as long to get anything done with that loan as it does with a bank. I think the Medical system needs work, but the last thing I want to have to depend on is an enormously bloated bureaucracy when my kid breaks an arm.

I don't think the government healthcare is mandatory for all citizens....it's just an option for uninsured people. You'd still be able to maintain private insurance, if you're happy with it.

I really don't want to hear about fiscal conservatism from the Republicans....they've been spending money like drunken sailors....not tax and spend, but charge and spend. How do you like our big "credit card" balance now? You think John McCain is going to balance things out? He's promoting that silly gas-tax holiday....one of the most retarded things I've ever heard....all that is going to do is spur demand, and add to the issue...total pandering for votes.

I just don't get the pure hatred for Obama...it's bizarre to me....you stated he pretends he's God? This country has been mired in shit for 8 years, and is in desperate need of a regime change.

 

[Ultron]

There are literally NO starving people in the US. It's the law here, no hospital can deny anyone of service, and there are tons of programs that help disabled people help. Our poorest people that live on Welfare still have cars, Air conditioned homes, TV's,DVD players etc. There are some that slip through the cracks etc, but for the most part all they had to do was ask.

are you serious?

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

There are literally NO starving people in the US. It's the law here, no hospital can deny anyone of service, and there are tons of programs that help disabled people help. Our poorest people that live on Welfare still have cars, Air conditioned homes, TV's,DVD players etc. There are some that slip through the cracks etc, but for the most part all they had to do was ask.

are you serious?

I echo this statement. I'm not knocking you as a person or calling you stupid, but Marshall Freak your certainly misinformed in this area. To say your seeing things through rose coloured glasses might be the understatement of the century.

The number of Americans working 2-3 jobs just to make ends meet in insane, current estimates on the number of truly homeless people hover around the 20-40 MILLION mark. That's just the reality, thats a large population that isn't offered the kind of legislature they obviously need.

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

I don't think the government healthcare is mandatory for all citizens....it's just an option for uninsured people. You'd still be able to maintain private insurance, if you're happy with it.

Best of both worlds IMO, works in a lot of countries very well.

I just don't get the pure hatred for Obama...it's bizarre to me....you stated he pretends he's God? This country has been mired in shit for 8 years, and is in desperate need of a regime change.

It's beyond me too, I can't possibly see ANY of the candidates being worse than Bush. I think Obama would be a great change for America. People seem to be getting hung up way to much on his Church, and his writings as a teen. Haven't you ever disagreed with something your pastor or priest said? Haven't you ever thought something privately that you'd never instigate?

 

[Marshall Freak]

I don't like the way the republicans have been spending either, but last I looked, the democrats are in charge of the purse now, and if Obama gets the presidency do you actually thing he's going to stop the horrific spending? John McCain on the other hand has said for years that we have to cut a lot of spending, and if you look at his record over the past 40 years, there's absolutely NO pork spending on his resume. Obama barely has a record at all because he hasn't done shit in the Senate, but there's hundreds of thousands attached to his name in Pork. So yes, I think McCain will do better at it than the current administration, and I think he'll be miles and miles ahead of Obama.

I was being facetious with the acting like a god statement. But look at everytime the press has pressed him about an issue, he starts instantly goes into a condescending attitude and lays the blame elsewhere. "Lay off my wife" maybe he should keep his bitch in check if he's going to send her out on the stump? Bad news for obama, when your wife gets active in a political process she's now fair game for criticism. When he quit his church, he went on a tirade about how he has to leave because words are being misconstrued.. He's the one that calls that pastor his mentor and spiritual advisor, nothing's been misconstrued, he just made bad judgements by hanging with the wrong people. I don't like his holier than thou attitude, and I think he's generally a moron.

 

[Marshall Freak]

There are literally NO starving people in the US. It's the law here, no hospital can deny anyone of service, and there are tons of programs that help disabled people help. Our poorest people that live on Welfare still have cars, Air conditioned homes, TV's,DVD players etc. There are some that slip through the cracks etc, but for the most part all they had to do was ask.

are you serious?

Yes. Find me news of one person that's starved to death in the US in the last few years.

 

[ttosh]

Very well put, and a blind liberal view. My view of God and Christianity has nothing to do with the liberal mindset. I am not going to debate this with you as I can see you have your minimalistic view of this already. Can you say socialism. And I think the Church and people of America should help others, just not let the Government regulate it, everything they touch goes to crap, Can you say Social Security.

Hows supporting others through state regulation a LIBERAL view?

Why is supporting thousands or millions of homeless people minimalistic exactly?

Please, "socialist"? Give me a break, are you a complete idiot? I said that those that cannot provide for themselves should be looked out for, especially in the case of someone with Autism, or Down Syndrome, or Paraplegia - the government should take the moral highground and do that. Becuase, lets face it, not a whole lot of other people would help.

Same goes for the homeless, many of them just need a chance to improve and start again, it's completely immoral to ignore them and lecture them on life choices. I'm sure if there were migating circumstances they regret them, no need to get morally superior to the less fortunate.

The reason your government regulations go to crap is because most of your policies are inefficent and generally just shit in every facet. This isn't to say that having government regulated healthcare, or social security is a bad idea, or impractical - it's not and works very well in dozens of other countries, just that your current models are terrible.

Moral of the story - Get a real government, one that can legislate properly and support those less fortunate - neither of which are BAD ideas.

I do not disagree with you at all. I just do not want my taxes taking care of the guy who spends his day drinking beer instead of working. The types you name above all need help. People in general should help and not expect the government to do everything for them. People are responsible, when is everyone going to grow up and not expect handouts all the time. The people you refer to all need help truly, and we as a society should help them period.

Moral of the story don't expect or rely on the government when people can make the difference themselves. The liberals want you to believe otherwise. So how is life in Australia? From your opinions it must be perfect.

 

[Marshall Freak]

There are literally NO starving people in the US. It's the law here, no hospital can deny anyone of service, and there are tons of programs that help disabled people help. Our poorest people that live on Welfare still have cars, Air conditioned homes, TV's,DVD players etc. There are some that slip through the cracks etc, but for the most part all they had to do was ask.

are you serious?

I echo this statement. I'm not knocking you as a person or calling you stupid, but Marshall Freak your certainly misinformed in this area. To say your seeing things through rose coloured glasses might be the understatement of the century.

The number of Americans working 2-3 jobs just to make ends meet in insane, current estimates on the number of truly homeless people hover around the 20-40 MILLION mark. That's just the reality, thats a large population that isn't offered the kind of legislature they obviously need.

No, There's around 744,000 homeless in the US. Out of 300,000,000 that's not an astronomical number when you consider how many of them have put themselves in that situation. And yes, there are programs to help them out if they decide to try.

 

[Chubtone]

I'm still trying to work out why so many Americans are against giving disabled and homeless people a chance

I think it's because we feel like we give enough already and that of the amount we give, too much of it gets wasted in beauracracy. The reason we may feel like we give enough already?

USA Today 2005 "Federal Aid Programs Expand at Record Rate"

"A sweeping expansion of social programs since 2000 has sparked a record increase in the number of Americans receiving federal government benefits such as college aid, food stamps and health care.

It was the largest five-year expansion of the federal safety net since the Great Society created programs such as Medicare and Medicaid in the 1960s.

Spending on these social programs was $1.3 trillion in 2005, up an inflation-adjusted 22% since 2000 and accounting for more than half of federal spending."

 

[Chubtone]

current estimates on the number of truly homeless people hover around the 20-40 MILLION mark. That's just the reality, thats a large population that isn't offered the kind of legislature they obviously need.

Are you on crack? That is a ridiculous number and places huge doubts on where the rest of your "information" comes from. You are talking about 1 in 10 people in the USA being homeless and ANYONE who lives here will just shake their heads in wonder when you start quoting utter nonsense like that.

LOL at the silly Australian.

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

I do not disagree with you at all. I just do not want my taxes taking care of the guy who spends his day drinking beer instead of working. The types you name above all need help. People in general should help and not expect the government to do everything for them. People are responsible, when is everyone going to grow up and not expect handouts all the time. The people you refer to all need help truly, and we as a society should help them period.

Moral of the story don't expect or rely on the government when people can make the difference themselves. The liberals want you to believe otherwise. So how is life in Australia? From your opinions it must be perfect.

Sure theres always a fine line between someone that needs help and someone who abuses the services provided, and it's not always clear cut.

Some people can make the difference, agreed, many can't - I've given examples previously.

Life in Australia is far from perfect - we have out share of problems. If this was a thread about issues in Australia politics or legislature I'd be just as critical, if not more so, than I am now.

Feel free to ask me any questions on Australia's successes or failures.

I think it's because we feel like we give enough already and that of the amount we give, too much of it gets wasted in beauracracy. The reason we may feel like we give enough already?

Understood. Seems to me the spending is not being utilised efficently or effectively. I'm not sure how relevant the figure you've quoted is - certainly it's a good starting point but I'd be interested to find out how much goes directly to helping homeless or disabled people. Public health care, collage aid - all good things but aren't directly helping the average homeless dude on the street - all that money could go into healthcare and not a cent to homeless people and it could still be called "federal aid". Though obviously a homeless guy will benefit from free health care.

No, There's around 744,000 homeless in the US. Out of 300,000,000 that's not an astronomical number when you consider how many of them have put themselves in that situation. And yes, there are programs to help them out if they decide to try.

I'd like to see your source on this figure. Your showing a remarkle lack on compassion for people that could have absolutely NO say in their situations - I'm sure there are people that are responsible for their homelessness. I'm sure there are many that aren't. I'm even more sure many of them want to and could reform and start again if people gave them a helping hand.

Unfortauntely most people won't - this is why the government should step in.

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

LOL at the silly Australian.

Why I outta...............