Does a 412 greenback cab have enough power handling...

[threadkiller]

for a 100 W head? I always thought you needed more power handing from your speakers than your amp can dish out. I would think a single 412 Greenback cab (4 x 25 W speakers) would be able to handle 100W but with no "safety" factor built in. I realize a 100 W head might transiently push more than 100W and that most speakers are rated on their rms power handling not peak. I guess it's a dumb question since plenty of people have run this combo but just wondering. I never understood why anyone would need 100W head until I plugged into a Metropoulos 45/100 and "felt" the difference. I'm interested in one but don't want to blow my speakers.

 

[Wizard of Ozz]

It should. I'd keep the volume at "9" or so to be safe. Some 100W are actually more like 120W, so be sure about the output power too.

 

['63-Strat]

No. Because no bands ever did this.


Seriously though, unless you're cranking your 100 watt amp up all the time I wouldn't worry that much about it. I wouldn't hesitate to do it with my head but I'm never cranking it at gigs or rehearsals.

 

[stratotone]

It should. I'd keep the volume at "9" or so to be safe. Some 100W are actually more like 120W, so be sure about the output power too.

Depends on the amp manufacturer, an old 100 watt marshall is a lot more than 120w.

 

['63-Strat]

It should. I'd keep the volume at "9" or so to be safe. Some 100W are actually more like 120W, so be sure about the output power too.

Depends on the amp manufacturer, an old 100 watt marshall is a lot more than 120w.

Yep, even my old always failing 900 combo was closer to 160 when measured.

 

[TheMagicEight]

for a 100 W head? I always thought you needed more power handing from your speakers than your amp can dish out. I would think a single 412 Greenback cab (4 x 25 W speakers) would be able to handle 100W but with no "safety" factor built in. I realize a 100 W head might transiently push more than 100W and that most speakers are rated on their rms power handling not peak. I guess it's a dumb question since plenty of people have run this combo but just wondering. I never understood why anyone would need 100W head until I plugged into a Metropoulos 45/100 and "felt" the difference. I'm interested in one but don't want to blow my speakers.

Amps are rated at 10% THD (total harmonic distortion). A cranked plexi will put out much closer to 200W than 100. You WILL damage / destroy the speakers.

 

[madrigal77]

Works just fine with the EVH 5150III head/cab. I crank mine all the time playing de-tuned metal and have never had a problem.

 

[TheMagicEight]

Works just fine with the EVH 5150III head/cab. I crank mine all the time playing de-tuned metal and have never had a problem.

Crank? You mean into power tube saturation?

Good luck....

 

[blackba]

A 100watt amp into a greenback 412 is not recommended. It is risky, just depends on how much risk you are willing to take.

 

[chunktone]

It should. I'd keep the volume at "9" or so to be safe. Some 100W are actually more like 120W, so be sure about the output power too.

Depends on the amp manufacturer, an old 100 watt marshall is a lot more than 120w.

Yep, even my old always failing 900 combo was closer to 160 when measured.

Ya, ime it's very common for tube amps to put out Much more power than rated. I had a JCM800 2203 that put out 180 watts, a Hiwatt Custom 100 that put out 195 watts, and a Randall RM100 that put out 195 watts. I would use an attenuator or more than 1 cab of green backs. 4 worked pretty good for me!

 

[Crunchity]

What about running a 50w head (lets say even a plexi type) into something similar...like a 4 x 12 with 30w G12H blackbacks (55hz)? Fairly safe, even cranking a bit?

 

[VC4Ever]

wow a lot of misinformed people here. You will never get 100W out of your amp unless you crank the shit all the way up. And I doubt you do so yes a 412 greenback cab is perfectly safe to use.

 

[chunktone]

wow a lot of misinformed people here. You will never get 100W out of your amp unless you crank the shit all the way up. And I doubt you do so yes a 412 greenback cab is perfectly safe to use.

A Randall certified repair guy measured the wattage of my old RM100 at 195, and a highly reputable amp modder/builder measured my JCM800 at 180 and Hiwatt at 195 when I had them in to be modded. You're probably right though, they don't know jack.

 

[Jofipe]

wow a lot of misinformed people here. You will never get 100W out of your amp unless you crank the shit all the way up. And I doubt you do so yes a 412 greenback cab is perfectly safe to use.

You doubt ppl crank their Marshall style amps?

 

[VC4Ever]

Fully cranked on 10? Sorry Hendrix. Well then you must be a rock star. Sorry. Simple solution get a full stack.

 

[VC4Ever]

Also this guy asked about 100 Watt head. Tubes have a max wattage rating so how the hell can your 100W head to pump out close to 200W? For example four 6L6 tubes in push-pull have a max wattage of 120W. I guess I'm the idiot...please enlighten me.

 

[50MkII]

From what I understand, a lot of amps in that power wattage rating usually hit full amplitude around 6+ especially true with a NMV Marshall. This was stated by a well-known amp tech or builder, but I cannot remember the source. If I do I will post it. At the Amp Shows, Metropoulos routinely matches a quad of Celestion Heritage "20wt"(read 25wt) G12M greenback RI speakers with their 12000 series and similar 100wt Marshall replicas with others playing through them non-attenuated and attenuated without blowing. I have not a problem cranking my NMV JMP '72 Marshall Model 1987 (50wt) amp through my Germino 4x12 with a quad of the Heritage 25wt G12M greenback RI's (wired series/parallel 1at 16 ohms). It is an aggressive one too, after around 7 it is does not get any louder. Keep in mind the difference in ratings being used which can sometimes be confusing by manufacturers- "programmed power", "rated power/power rating" and a couple others that are typically used.

 

[gtrwun]

Hmmmmmmmm. Think about it guys. What about all the guys who played Marshall's in the early/mid 70's? Arena bands. Cranking the shit out their amps. Only 2 speakers back then were the H30 and the M25 GB. Some guys may have changed speakers to JBL's or whatever, but plenty of guys were cranking the Plexi's to the max into 100 watt cabs with greenbacks. Did they blow speakers? Sure they did. Did it sound incredible? Absolutely it did. Its not 100% safe to run a 100 watt head thru a 100 watt cab, but how many of us are playing arena's? Ive never blown a speaker in my life and I gigged regularly for 25-30 years.

 

[blackba]

Hmmmmmmmm. Think about it guys. What about all the guys who played Marshall's in the early/mid 70's? Arena bands. Cranking the shit out their amps. Only 2 speakers back then were the H30 and the M25 GB. Some guys may have changed speakers to JBL's or whatever, but plenty of guys were cranking the Plexi's to the max into 100 watt cabs with greenbacks. Did they blow speakers? Sure they did. Did it sound incredible? Absolutely it did. Its not 100% safe to run a 100 watt head thru a 100 watt cab, but how many of us are playing arena's? Ive never blown a speaker in my life and I gigged regularly for 25-30 years.

As I said before its all in the risk you are willing to take. Its like speeding, do what you can afford, just don't say that its recommended. I am taking a risk on running my 50Watt amp through 2 anni G12H30s, but its a risk I am willing to take and I have had no issues. I can tell you when I played in my last band I used a 50Watt silver jubilee and I pushed those CL80s in my 212 cab. I personally liked in that case, not really worrying about blowing the speakers.

E-mail Jim at Scumback if you want to get an ear full. He has addressed this topic 1000 times at least. I am sure he would recommend his 65Watt speakers in a 412 with a 100Watt amp.

 

[TheMagicEight]

Also this guy asked about 100 Watt head. Tubes have a max wattage rating so how the hell can your 100W head to pump out close to 200W? For example four 6L6 tubes in push-pull have a max wattage of 120W. I guess I'm the idiot...please enlighten me.

No, they don't. They have a maximum output of 120 watts at nearly 0 THD.

http://www.ampage.org/td/vtd6l6.html

Consider yourself enlightened.