Mesa 4x12: Standard (oversized) vs Traditional

[thegame]

All I know is I tend to prefer 8-ohm cabs vs 16 of the same speaker configuration.

8 ohm speakers have a higher intensity pick attack and more focussed midrange. I’d be happy with any of my favourite speakers in 16 ohms but to highly nitpick the choice, my preference is also 8 ohms.

 

[Exo-metal]

I want to go back to the OP topic about comparisons. When the oversize cab is used with other amps besides the recto is that a mistake? I think when it is paired with a recto could it be that the low end of the amp fills out the cab in a way that makes the magic happen?

 

[thegame]

I want to go back to the OP topic about comparisons. When the oversize cab is used with other amps besides the recto is that a mistake? I think when it is paired with a recto could it be that the low end of the amp fills out the cab in a way that makes the magic happen?

The answer to both questions is yes, most of the time IMO. The stiff construction of the OS cab tends to control the Recto loose low end. That same quality, more often than not, can choke the life out of amps that pair best with cabinets that “breathe” E.g vintage Marshall cabs

 

[Greazygeo]

I want to go back to the OP topic about comparisons. When the oversize cab is used with other amps besides the recto is that a mistake? I think when it is paired with a recto could it be that the low end of the amp fills out the cab in a way that makes the magic happen?

I use my OS cab with everything I have. Multiple 60’s Marshalls, ‘74 Hiwatt, ‘78 2203, Triple Recto, 5150, 66 Deluxe Reverb ‘67 Princeton Reverb, Wizard etc…same with my Wizard and Vintage Marshall cabs.

It sounds fine with all of my stuff. It is a very easy cab to record. Not boomy etc. Pretty even sounding.

What is weird is I find with my Recto, the bass is almost all the way off. It is way too much for me.

 

[Exo-metal]

Yeah, well you're probably fucked up. You're from Ohio anyway

 

[jabps]

I picked up a Mesa Standard (oversized) 4x12 a while back and absolutely hated it. Got rid of it after one week. It was super honky and overly present, with an unpleasant and unmusical sound for my needs. No matter where you stood, it sounded like your ear was right up against the grill cloth. And it took all the bark and growl out of my amps.

A traditional cab just arrived today (new) and I think it's night-and-day better. More balanced sound, less ear fatigue, more growl and grunt and more thump. It still has a bit of that V30 harshness in the highs. But for now, I can use a graphic EQ in the amp's loop to take that out until the speakers relax a bit over time.

But for years I've wondered how these two cabs differ and have always relied on other people's reviews. I should have gotten one of these years ago.

Same.

Always wanted to like the oversize, tested and tried them so many times but same experience for me. Smaller trad size cabs just sounded tighter and better to my ears regardless of speaker. Not just Mesa either, had the Mode 4 oversized Marshall cab that I couldn't get rid of fast enough either for the same reason.

 

[Exo-metal]

The missing link is the recto. Later in the thread someone will post their findings about the tie between the cab and these amps. For now I'm keeping my MF400B for this exact purpose. Now I need another mesa

 

[BABMusic]

You all have inspired me to take my amp to a Guitar Center and try out some other cabs. That's the best way I can find out if what I have is good enough.

 

[metalmm785]

I had both. I like my OS cab better. I also have a Road King cab, but that's a different animal.

 

[Scumback Speakers]

Both of those diagrams appear to make two series pairs of speakers in parallel at the jack. @Scumback Speakers is that correct? Top looks Aiken style, bottom looks more complicated by running four wires from the jack instead of two which pass down to the next series pair via the extra tabs on the positive and negative speaker terminals.

Check out this page at Celestion.com https://celestion.com/?s=wiring

 

[Greazygeo]

Yeah, well you're probably fucked up. You're from Ohio anyway

Well there is that…

 

[FourT6and2]

Check out this page at Celestion.com https://celestion.com/?s=wiring

Yeah that looks to be the same method Bogner uses—except they move the doubled connection at the jack down to the speakers to keep it cleaner, but same thing electrically.

They call it series/parallel. But on your website, you call it parallel/series...

 

[NinjaRaf]

I've had 2 OS cabs, a Trad slant, and Trad straight. I still have 1 OS and the Trad straight. I didn't find any difference in tone between the 2 OS cabs. My other guitar player bought one of them. They both sound amazing. Best sounding cabs I've owned, for sure. The Trad slant was so extremely bright that I couldn't deal with it. The Trad straight is great! It sounds like you would expect, I guess? For me, it has less weight to the notes compared to the OS cabs. It's tighter and clearer. Slightly brighter, but I think that's mostly because the low end is less accentuated. I like both for different amps. My EVH 100S is perfect with the OS, while my EVH 50 can get a little woofy sounding through the OS. But the 100S loses that weight through the trad, while the 50 cleans up and sounds tighter and more aggressive through the trad. I like having both, but overall I prefer the OS, and if I had to pick one, it would be the OS.

Both cabs currently have Karnivores, but I played them both a bunch with the V30s, too, before the Karnivores were released. Similar results, generally.

 

[Brandonrz]

Love the Mesa oversized

 

[Nigel]

I've had 2 OS cabs, a Trad slant, and Trad straight. I still have 1 OS and the Trad straight. I didn't find any difference in tone between the 2 OS cabs. My other guitar player bought one of them. They both sound amazing. Best sounding cabs I've owned, for sure. The Trad slant was so extremely bright that I couldn't deal with it. The Trad straight is great! It sounds like you would expect, I guess? For me, it has less weight to the notes compared to the OS cabs. It's tighter and clearer. Slightly brighter, but I think that's mostly because the low end is less accentuated. I like both for different amps. My EVH 100S is perfect with the OS, while my EVH 50 can get a little woofy sounding through the OS. But the 100S loses that weight through the trad, while the 50 cleans up and sounds tighter and more aggressive through the trad. I like having both, but overall I prefer the OS, and if I had to pick one, it would be the OS.

Both cabs currently have Karnivores, but I played them both a bunch with the V30s, too, before the Karnivores were released. Similar results, generally.

Almost like the extra 50 watts gives more bass that wants for more internal air volume. When I ran an Ugly Amps Big Ugly 100 through my OS playing bass notes with a Boss OC-2 it was God size, so rad. Need to grab my trad 4x12 size and try it with my 60 watt heads now.

 

[D-Rock]

When I bought my Trad slant new in 2006 I walked into the store with $1k in hand wanting a Mesa cab. I had been playing a straight cab that was pretty dark so was rather keen on getting a slant.

It's been a mainstay Goldilocks cab for me over the years. Not too bright, not too dark. Just right. I've never opened the cab. Factory sealed.

Never played a Mesa OS, but I have 2 other OS cabs and they are not boomy or bloated sounding at all.

Regarding Mesa OS....Ola mentions it's his fav cab ever. He gets great tones out of them IMO.

In a recent episode of SWOLA he takes the viewer into his home garage storage where he has Haunted and At The Gates back lines stored.

He proceeds to show a Mesa OS cab that he bought used for cheap while on the road. Ola then demos the cab showing how BAD it's currently sounding, revealing the speakers are out of phase.
He then corrects the issue and demos the cab again and it sounds HUGE.

Starts at 14:16.....

 

[FourT6and2]

Regarding Mesa OS....Ola mentions it's his fav cab ever. He gets great tones out of them IMO.

In all his videos where he switches between multiple cabs, I usually like his Mesa OS the least. I think his smaller, traditional-sized cabs sound better. To each his own I suppose.

In a recent episode of SWOLA he takes the viewer into his home garage storage where he has Haunted and At The Gates back lines stored.

He proceeds to show a Mesa OS cab that he bought used for cheap while on the road. Ola then demos the cab showing how BAD it's currently sounding, revealing the speakers are out of phase.
He then corrects the issue and demos the cab again and it sounds HUGE.

Starts at 14:16.....

He says the out-of-phase issue manifested as a lack of bass. The OS I had didn't have a lack of bass. It was just gross sounding. Also while I totally believe him when he says his cab was out of phase, when he's demonstrating that in that video, the back panel of the cab is clearly off. Of course it's going to sound bad like that... Then he corrects the wiring reattaches the back panel. So it's not exactly a fair comparison. It also didn't come from Mesa wired like that. Previous owner did it.

 

[D-Rock]

In all his videos where he switches between multiple cabs, I usually like his Mesa OS the least. I think his smaller, traditional-sized cabs sound better. To each his own I suppose.


He says the out-of-phase issue manifested as a lack of bass. The OS I had didn't have a lack of bass. It was just gross sounding. Also while I totally believe him when he says his cab was out of phase, when he's demonstrating that in that video, the back panel of the cab is clearly off. Of course it's going to sound bad like that... Then he corrects the wiring reattaches the back panel. So it's not exactly a fair comparison. It also didn't come from Mesa wired like that. Previous owner did it.

Yes for sure. He sure gets good sounds out the cab though when put back to stock wiring. I think he typically runs somewhat scooped mids with moderate lows dialed in. Hard to say what would make one sound better than another one that's exactly the same other than it being quality control issues with the product or individual tone tools and shaping differences.

 

[Holy-diver]

Both trad and OS mesa cabs are great. I have a 2003 Straight/slant OS still that might be my favorite of the ones I have owned. The straight trad I had was awesome as well. I did have a straight OS from 99 that came stock with greenbacks that I absolutely hated though.

 

[dave74]

Theoretically,,,,say you have the modern OS mesa true-straight cab. (not the older version with the slant baffle). (I have both btw)

OK, say you wanted to tune the true-straight to respond more like the older straight-slant, or even more like the traditional straight, which btw has very close to the same internal air space as the OS straight-slant. Most people are unaware that the traditional straight and the old OS straight-slant are so close in air volume.

So if you cut a piece of dense-wood 4x4 almost as wide as the cab, glued some auto carpet to it's bottom and then glued some Velcro strips to the inside of the cab's bottom, couldn't you just stick it in there at the bottom back of the cab's interior and effectively displace the extra internal size of the OS straight.

It would be a quickly reversible mod since all you'd have to do is pull it out if you didn't like the change.
Also by adjusting the size of the board you could effectively tune the internal space to your liking.

Anyone tried this or have a better idea for internal air-space tuning?