Van Halen Panama tone

Anyone have input on pickups? I'm still of the belief that most tracks on 1984 are a PAF in the Flying V and Panama is an A2 based pickup, likely a Custom Custom.
 
I’m listening to the isolated Panama track over and over. Can’t believe how much sag is in that tone.

Sounds like the amp is variac’d super low. Really loose low notes. But when in the full mix it sounds absolutely perfect for that song.

Maybe Panama is a cranked Bassman!
 
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Girl Gone Bad, Hot for Teacher, and Drop Dead Legs are the '58 Gibson flying V, with low-output A2 PAFs. Panama is a hard, one, and Ed (this was back in the 90s when I was doing some work with the band) couldn't remember if he used the Franky or his (at that time) brand new 5150. The 5150 had an SD '59 with an A2 in it. The Frank had that rewound PAF in it (we think overwound and from the 335 but no one - even Ed - was really sure it could have even been from one of his '59 LPs but didn't think so).

The 910 was on VHII. Listen to "Women in Love" and "Light Up The Sky". It was in his rig on the end of the VH1 tour.
 
Wow. Great info, that’s awesome.

Ive never tried a Duncan 59. I’m going to order one and I’ll put an A2 in it. Have to try it.

So it sounds like Panama definitely wasn’t a Custom Custom? Was that pickup used at all later on?
 
I just popped the custom custom back in my alder bodied strat.. I can maybe see it for 1984 but at the same time, it compresses a bit more than I hear on that album. That album sounds more PAFish to me too. Also, wasn't an LP used for the rythm of Hot for Teacher or did I dream that?

EDIT it was, I didn't scroll up!! 59 with an A2 in it sounds interesting though. I love my JB2.
 
Here’s a new clip with the 69 super lead. Straight in, no pedals in front of the amp. Fryette PS100 and into a 1969 Marshall 4x12 with pulsonic greenbacks. A lot closer. I played a little before the track started. You can hear the slight detune.

I also had my variac set at 98 volts. Tubes were biased at 117 volts but it sounded closer this way.

I botched that damn 2nd fret harmonic. I hate that. This setup leaves little room for error. It doesn’t cover up sloppy playing like a modern high gain amp. Every mistake shows.

 
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There's definitely detune on Panama, on left guitar is almost dry, and there some lower mixed detune, delay and reverb to the right.
 
RedPlated said:
Here’s a new clip with the 69 super lead. Straight in to amp, no pedals. Fryette PS100 and into a 1969 Marshall 4x12 with pulsonic greenbacks. A lot closer. I played a little before the track started. You can hear the slight detune.

I also had my variac set at 98 volts. Tubes were biased at 117 volts but it sounded closer this way.

I botched that damn 2nd fret harmonic. I hate that. This setup leaves little room for error. It doesn’t cover up sloppy playing like a modern high gain amp. Every mistake shows.

Click to expand...

Such a killer set up my Brother !!
 
RedPlated said:
Wow. Great info, that’s awesome.

Ive never tried a Duncan 59. I’m going to order one and I’ll put an A2 in it. Have to try it.

So it sounds like Panama definitely wasn’t a Custom Custom? Was that pickup used at all later on?
Click to expand...
In this Ossie Ahsen pickup comparion, the SD 59 is Diver Down and 1984 IMHO, it has those single coil quackiness to it that an overwound PAF tends to lose. I love my 78 model SD but just listen to the SD59 and tell me what you hear. Judging by your clip I would say just add the detune and you are pretty much there, man that 69 Marshall sound excellent....congrats, congrats, congrats. You could pick up a $60 mooer on the cheap or that new Eventide micropitch for $279.00 and you are there.
 
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Search on YT, there are two tracks of Ed messing around with Eventide settings while practicing. This is during the 1984 recording time period. He was wanting more gain and the Eventide gave him more perceived gain. Landee really had to tone it down. Ed wanted more.
 
RedPlated said:
Here’s a new clip with the 69 super lead. Straight in to amp, no pedals. Fryette PS100 and into a 1969 Marshall 4x12 with pulsonic greenbacks. A lot closer. I played a little before the track started. You can hear the slight detune.

I also had my variac set at 98 volts. Tubes were biased at 117 volts but it sounded closer this way.

I botched that damn 2nd fret harmonic. I hate that. This setup leaves little room for error. It doesn’t cover up sloppy playing like a modern high gain amp. Every mistake shows.

Click to expand...

just some KILLER tone in this thread.

"no pedals"? the de-tune and little bit of reverb i'm hearing? it sounds phe-fucking-Nomenal btw! just killer...
 
Thanks guys... I'm really happy with the tone from the 69' Super lead. The 69' cab with Pulsonics was absolutely the missing ingredient. They sound different than any other greenbacks I've used.

Yeah, no pedals in front of the amp. The fx are from the PS100 into an fx unit.

There is detune on that last clip I added. Probably not coming through as much as I thought. That clip is the super lead into the PS100, line out of the PS100 into a Mark L mixer into TC G major 2 with a detune patch with delay and reverb, into a Matrix GT100 power amp and out to two Friedman 1x12 cabs, one on each side. I'll try increasing the mix of the detune on a future clip.
 
RedPlated said:
Thanks guys... I'm really happy with the tone from the 69' Super lead. The 69' cab with Pulsonics was absolutely the missing ingredient. They sound different than any other greenbacks I've used.

There is detune on that last clip I added. Probably not coming through as much as I thought. That clip is the super lead into the PS100, line out of the PS100 into a Mark L mixer into TC G major 2 with a detune patch with delay and reverb, into a Matrix GT100 power amp and out to two Friedman 1x12 cabs, one on each side. I'll try increasing the mix of the detune on a future clip.
Click to expand...
Yeah the dry volume seems to be overshadowing the two Wet cabs. What cents did you set your detune at .9999 cents?

I have not had the pleasure to play through an actual Pulsonic coned 0014 greenback so I envy you...as those who have said they are like no other Celestion. I have since been led to the possibility that 55HZ 12H-30 blackbacks were also a speaker of choice for ED and have been very happy with my 12H-30 55Hz heritage speakers.

Per Mike Soldano, try 85ACV on the variac:2thumbsup:that will give you the sag and low end squish you are noting in your assessment of Diver Down, 1984 tone. According to Mike Ed had a favorite Marshall Super Bass that he also played variaced at 85VAC. I see you mentioned a Bassman and we all know Ed's affinity for his Bandmaster heads ala Ronnie Montrose.

Either the 78Model(A2 magnet) or a stock SD59 will give you that single coil quack that you hear on DD and 1984. A the time of DD Ed's pickup supposedly had one of the coils partially shorting out.

When did Ed officially start using W/D/W? 5150? or did it start on 1984?
 
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I've heard Ed also used black back g12m. I have those in my 72' cab. Much tighter, brighter with aggressive upper mid.

I just ordered a Duncan 59 standard spaced bridge for my Charvel. I've got some A2 mags, I'll try it with the stock A5 also.

I think have the detune set wider than .9999, I'd have to check it again.

I may also re-bias the amp for 90v AC. Up to 50ma or so since plate voltage should be much lower. It's got a good set of Siemens/ RFT el34 in it. Wish I had a quad of Sylvania 6CA7. Come to think of it, I have two of those in a drawer and two more in my Mesa IIC+. Don't know if they will be within range of each other bias-wise.
 
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