SonVolt
Well-known member
Bob Bradshaw was on Tone Talk a few years back and said he was able to get the Axe-Fx so close to the 2290 that neither him nor The Edge could tell the difference when A/B'd. With that I've gone the Fractal VP4 route.
Michael Nielson agrees with me: the FTT Flight Time is the best delay pedal ever created
ChurchHill
Well-known member
For the effect, I'm sure that's true. For the sound of just running the signal through it, not quite, at least in my experience. I was using a 2290 as a split with the delay outs feeding the wet sends and wanted to find out if I liked it better that way, or just on a send and mixed with the dry. So, I A/B'd mine and I could tell a difference, with the caveat that it was using my rig and for my playing. Others may not hear the difference, but I did.
FWIW, I love the 2290, but I shot it out in that usage, as a split with the delay bypassed, with a PCM41, and I liked the PCM41 better, but not by much, and again, for my rig.
jabps
Well-known member
Yep, why I like the Nemesis. Timeline does a good job of that as well. It's kinda of a toss up between the Timeline and Nemesis for me. Nemesis is more pristine on the digital part but the Timeline has the readout and the ability to tap through presets better. I have the Collider as well as I was going to build a super small board around it but just to side tracked the last few years with all these "board" plans lol.
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jabps
Well-known member
If I go with the VP4 I'm focusing on digital delays and some verbs running into the loop. If it can do a great digital delay like the Nemesis and Timeline, then that is what I'm looking for. Also not running stereo either, just don't have the time for all that anymore.
Rest of the front end stuff ala Chorus, Flanger, Vibe etc.. will be dedicated pedals. If some of the modulation stuff is good on the VP4, then it'll just be icing on the cake.
My biggest fear with the Fractal stuff is the programming, I did not get on with the FX-8 at all and I have programmed alot of rack units through the years.
japetus
Awawa
Moderator
I am into pedal delays that each do one delay. The Line 6 4 switch one changed my mind in some senses.
ChurchHill
Well-known member
IMO, the delays and reverbs on the VP4 are really good. The modulation is also really good. The only thing I don't like about it is that, if you use it in front of the amp, you only get a mono loop to use in the loop. It has two inputs and two outputs and you can use them as two separate loops, but using it that way, both are limited to mono. If that last part was stereo, like 2 inputs and 3 outputs, it'd be just about perfect.
As for programming, I think it's easy, but I only use the computer-based editor. I would hate it if I was limited to just the pedal itself. They were trying to keep the form factor small, so I get it, but it would be much more usable if it had a wireless editor for a tablet or a phone instead just USB.
Shask
Well-known member
I have thought about a VP4 also, as I have an Axe 2 and FM3. They sound great, but the idea of the pedals is to have something simple. I also want analog dry through, and the VP4 + mixer starts getting very non- simple.
DanTravis62
Moderator
Moderator
Yep. This is precisely why I went the FT route.
I used to have a midi setup with both a rack and a pedalboard for my wet/dry rig, and it was glorious but just too much
The whole idea was trying to get as close to that tone as I could and making it simple enough to be easy to set up and gig with
Shask
Well-known member
I am glad I am not crazy and not the only one hearing this, lol.
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Hack
That thing looks terrifying..
DanTravis62
Moderator
Moderator
It's the best delay pedal ever
SonVolt
Well-known member
Shask
Well-known member
Yeah, I have a rack mixer I run with my old Axe 2, and I have a FM3 I could hook up in there also. If I got a VP4, my goal would be smaller and simpler, not the same mess on the floor, lol.
I dont like what running straight through the Axe 2 or FM3 does to the dynamics, so I don't trust the VP4 would be better for me.
lol
Well-known member
Dang, that thing looks nuts. Good thing I’m not all that into delay. I’ve got a boss dm2w I’ll engage for like 2 minutes before I turn it off lol.
JonPearson1994
Active member
For what the thing costs it better be the best!
I really want one, but I also want to do a comparison of the Flight Time and the 2290 emulation on an Axe FX. When I still had my AFIII, the 2290 delay was always my favorite.
I really want one, but I also want to do a comparison of the Flight Time and the 2290 emulation on an Axe FX. When I still had my AFIII, the 2290 delay was always my favorite.
scottosan
Well-known member
Easy to emulate analog. The Deep Blue Delay IMHO does analog better than any analog delay
lol
Well-known member
Yeah that’s true.
rstites
Well-known member
Correct - easy to emulate. The warmth people enjoy with analog is just the natural filtering of the analog medium. Bucket Brigade is just a bunch of capacitors which naturally acts as a filter, though the amount does change with the delay time. Tape delay is more just degradation due to play/record but isn't nearly so extreme.
You can emulate those easily in software, but really just pumping the delay through a filter before mixing with the dry-through gets you most of the way there. I built a couple of pedals like that in the early 00's I was using into a clean Fender amp. They sounds great - simple but great and a bunch easier to built than an actual analog delay.
At the time, we all loved how digital didn't degrade the signal, but later people started realizing they loved the warmth.
ChurchHill
Well-known member
I think many people would be shocked at how clear the delays are from a well-maintained and properly functioning tape delay.
The Echoplex EP-3 is arguably better known for what its preamp does to the tone, even when the delay is bypassed. The Korg SDD-3000, too, even though that's digital. The 2290 has its own sound, too, as do Lexicons and Eventides, or for that matter, 1176 compressors, even when they're not compressing.
I agree, the quality of analog delays, BBDs, is easy to replicate in digital. It's the rest of the circuit that most emulations don't emulate, and to me, that's where a big part of the magic is. The FTT Flight Time is the best at emulating the sound of the rest of the 2290 circuit, IMO.
I realize I'm probably in the minority of people who care about such things, but to me, without the sound of the entire circuit, a 2290 is just another modulated digital delay with panning and ducking. It's that specific sweetening that the entire circuit provides that makes it so special.
The Echoplex EP-3 is arguably better known for what its preamp does to the tone, even when the delay is bypassed. The Korg SDD-3000, too, even though that's digital. The 2290 has its own sound, too, as do Lexicons and Eventides, or for that matter, 1176 compressors, even when they're not compressing.
I agree, the quality of analog delays, BBDs, is easy to replicate in digital. It's the rest of the circuit that most emulations don't emulate, and to me, that's where a big part of the magic is. The FTT Flight Time is the best at emulating the sound of the rest of the 2290 circuit, IMO.
I realize I'm probably in the minority of people who care about such things, but to me, without the sound of the entire circuit, a 2290 is just another modulated digital delay with panning and ducking. It's that specific sweetening that the entire circuit provides that makes it so special.
