The Second Amendment and David Hogg

[VonBonfire]

That’s pretty wild to me. There are various classes of licenses for driving different vehicles, but not owning guns?
It seems like there would be a lot less of a stigma against guns if they were harder to get than say, a forklift operator license.

Guns are clearly not going to go away, but they will continue to get more sophisticated. they just seem so unregulated

Actually guns are like amps. Most of the best ones were made before 1970 and most of the basic design of a modern sporting rifle was completed by the 50's. Just my opinion.

No gun owner cares whether there is stigma against them. It's not uncommon here to have a loaded rifle in your truck at hand. It's a fundamental right. that should be granted to every American. I feel the same way about felons getting their voting rights back after they served the time. They should also get their gun rightst back if they serve their time.

Any number of people shoot every sunday afternoon out here after church. Sometimes it's a few different people at the same time. I have some steel targets I need to set up.

 

[CrazyNutz]

I got tired of paying range fees in the city so I bought a property in the country big enough to shoot. Mostly pistols....

Yeah, I hear ya. My brother lives out of the city limits, he has a range on his property we shoot at.

 

[VonBonfire]

Yeah, I hear ya. My brother lives out of the city limits, he has a range on his property we shoot at.

Outdoor range is the only way to go IMO. And steel is so much more fun than paper.

 

[Dan Gleesak]

Actually guns are like amps. Most of the best ones were made before 1970 and most of the basic design of a modern sporting rifle was completed by the 50's. Just my opinion.

No gun owner cares whether there is stigma against them. It's not uncommon here to have a loaded rifle in your truck at hand. It's a fundamental right. that should be granted to every American. I feel the same way about felons getting their voting rights back after they served the time. They should also get their gun rightst back if they serve their time.

Any number of people shoot every sunday afternoon out here after church. Sometimes it's a few different people at the same time. I have some steel targets I need to set up.

I think the stigma is important because it’s what keeps both sides from ever compromising and coming up with a way to control something that needs to be controlled.
I love target shooting so I get why people own guns. And I’ve also lived in some absolute shitholes so I understand why some people would want to own a gun for protection.
But I think there is a wide gap between the right to protect yourself and wanting to blow something apart from 100 yards away. That’s the disconnect that people can’t seem to compromise on.

People think I’m weird for not being bothered by a few hours of drag queens in school, but my daughter has been doing active shooter drills a few times a year since she was 4. Drag queens are the last thing I’m worried about my daughter being exposed to ya know?

It’s difficult to discuss guns because any resistance is usually seen as wanting to ban them. I don’t think a ban will solve anything, but I do think some forethought has to be put in to what people can and cannot own, and what the process is to own them

 

[CrazyNutz]

Yes but you have free will as did they. People choose their pathways and the two pathways are the right hand path, good or the left hand path, evil. You are presented with these choices daily.

Ok, take a minute, and think about this. How can God be ALL KNOWING, and you still have free will?

If God has prior knowledge, your path was already charted my friend.

You sound like legal counsel who makes excuses for a criminal who is facing execution.

Nope, back to the children. The children are innocent, they would not be facing execution.

The scripture says the earth was full of violence and that men plotted evil constantly. His own chosen people also did not fare well when they defied the Lord after leaving Egypt. The ground swallowed them up. He IS a jealous God. Fear of him is wisdom. That biblical. So even if you criticisms are fair you are like someone criticizing the boss. The boss doesn't have to care if you think he's wrong, you aren't the one running the business.

Ok again the children had nothing to do with this. Why murder them by drowning?

Also how can God be jealous? He had full knowledge of what everyone would do before making the decision to create them.

That's like inviting your buds over to bang your wife, and then getting mad about it ?‍

 

[VonBonfire]

I think the stigma is important because it’s what keeps both sides from ever compromising and coming up with a way to control something that needs to be controlled.
I love target shooting so I get why people own guns. And I’ve also lived in some absolute shitholes so I understand why some people would want to own a gun for protection.
But I think there is a wide gap between the right to protect yourself and wanting to blow something apart from 100 yards away. That’s the disconnect that people can’t seem to compromise on.

People think I’m weird for not being bothered by a few hours of drag queens in school, but my daughter has been doing active shooter drills a few times a year since she was 4. Drag queens are the last thing I’m worried about my daughter being exposed to ya know?

It’s difficult to discuss guns because any resistance is usually seen as wanting to ban them. I don’t think a ban will solve anything, but I do think some forethought has to be put in to what people can and cannot own, and what the process is to own them

Thanks for a pleasant reply.

The stigma is localized, so maybe it makes a difference in some areas. In southern, and rural places in general, there is not any stigma. In Austin sometimes people have swords, machetes, and AR-15's on their backs.

I own guns like I own wrenches. They are tools meant to serve a purpose. Hunting, defense, and of course occasional enjoyment.

I don't want my kids exposed to drag queens or active shooter drills. Fortunately my kids are done with school. I would've never done public education but my wife wanted them to have a "normal" life yeah ok. Neither active shooter drills or drag queens is normal to me. An active shooter drill to me is like run and gun where you are on the move shooting multiple targets for fun and competiton, not avoiding getting shot.

I don't believe in any real restrictions on guns I guess. People reject a creator and so life is cheap and meaningless to them and people's lives are therefore worthless because they are not created in God's image so I guess maybe it's easier to pull the trigger with that mindset. Only prayer and society turning back towards Christ is really going to change it. Laws will just be a band-aid that negatively affect too many people who have nothing to do with criminal acts.

 

[VonBonfire]

Ok, take a minute, and think about this. How can God be ALL KNOWING, and you still have free will?

I know my dog will take the doggie biscuit, but he doesn't have to if he's not hungry. It doesn't mean I have some sort of control over the dog. Add to that people being creatures of habit just the same as the dog. The whole point of Torah is that people are unfaithful to the Lord, yet he is faithful to his promises.

If God has prior knowledge, your path was already charted my friend.

No the sun shined, I woke up, and went about doing the things I wanted to to do. I chose. As did you.

Nope, back to the children. The children are innocent, they would not be facing execution.

Innocent according to your limited perception. Perhaps their very human genome had been corrupted? Ever considered they were no longer fully human? You're playing the role of prosecuting attorney but all your evidence is hearsay and circumstantial.

Also how can God be jealous? He had full knowledge of what everyone would do before making the decision to create them.

God loves you and desires that you love him back, willingly and of your own accord. He knows what path you will ultimately take but he does not force you to tread it.

 

[CrazyNutz]

I think the stigma is important because it’s what keeps both sides from ever compromising and coming up with a way to control something that needs to be controlled.
I love target shooting so I get why people own guns. And I’ve also lived in some absolute shitholes so I understand why some people would want to own a gun for protection.
But I think there is a wide gap between the right to protect yourself and wanting to blow something apart from 100 yards away. That’s the disconnect that people can’t seem to compromise on.

People think I’m weird for not being bothered by a few hours of drag queens in school, but my daughter has been doing active shooter drills a few times a year since she was 4. Drag queens are the last thing I’m worried about my daughter being exposed to ya know?

It’s difficult to discuss guns because any resistance is usually seen as wanting to ban them. I don’t think a ban will solve anything, but I do think some forethought has to be put in to what people can and cannot own, and what the process is to own them

I will always maintain this.

Most gun owners would own a fraction of the Guns they have now if people were not trying to take them away.

And

LGBTQ+++++ would be less in peoples face if people were not actively fighting to limit their rights.


Who's the villain here? Fox, msnbc, cnn, and most politicians. They are the ones with something to gain.

 

[VonBonfire]

I will always maintain this.

Most gun owners would own a fraction of the Guns they have now if people were not trying to take them away.

And

LGBTQ+++++ would be less in peoples face if people were not actively fighting to limit their rights.


Who's the villain here? Fox, msnbc, cnn, and most politicians. They are the ones with something to gain.

They use marginalized groups as a sledgehammer to try and split and reshape society. You are correct. Those news channels are criminal.

 

[CrazyNutz]

I know my dog will take the doggie biscuit, but he doesn't have to if he's not hungry. It doesn't mean I have some sort of control over the dog. Add to that people being creatures of habit just the same as the dog. The whole point of Torah is that people are unfaithful to the Lord, yet he is faithful to his promises.

Huh? That's nothing like God's ALL KNOWING powers. You're dumbing it down. God knows everything in great detail before even creating you.

No the sun shined, I woke up, and went about doing the things I wanted to to do. I chose. As did you.

Again if god has all the knowledge before creating you, you are not choosing.

Innocent according to your limited perception. Perhaps their very human genome had been corrupted? Ever considered they were no longer fully human? You're playing the role of prosecuting attorney but all your evidence is hearsay and circumstantial.

Again God has prior knowledge he's ALL KNOWING. He created them with the corrupted genome.

God loves you and desires that you love him back, willingly and of your own accord. He knows what path you will ultimately take but he does not force you to tread it.

Man this is mental gymnastics, he knows what path you'll take, then why did he create you?

 

[CrazyNutz]

Ok @VonBonfire

Take this hypothetical analogy.

I create a robot, and as his creator I know exactly what it will do before, and after I create it.

I know this robot will commit an egregious crime.

I create it anyway. It commits the crime

Am I able to say, well, it had free will so I'm not responsible? ?‍

 

[VonBonfire]

Again if god has all the knowledge before creating you, you are not choosing.

I can choose to curse you out or bless you right now. God knows which one I will choose but he doesn't force me to do either. You're basically making an argument that says a murderer is just carrying out what God wanted him to do. The devil made me do it nonsense. If I am playing mental gymnastics then you are swinging on the monkey bars next to me.

 

[JTyson]

Confiscate guns from all democrats and never let another one purchase a gun or knife or hammer, brick, baseball bat, weed eater, trimming shears, battery acid, fireworks of any kind, scissors, shovels and vehicles...
87% of all crime, mass shootings and felony assaults with a weapon of any kind stops..
There you go, tighter gun laws that would actually save innocent lives and make a huge difference. The rest of us have no interest in tighter gun laws and don't give a shit wether or not anyone else approves or disapproves. We are not the problem. If you happen to be one of those poor delusional idiots who think criminals care what gun laws are passed, and will abide by them, you are dumb as a brick...
You're welcome..

 

[VonBonfire]

Ok @VonBonfire

Take this hypothetical analogy.

I create a robot, and as his creator I know exactly what it will do before, and after I create it.

I know this robot will commit an egregious crime.

I create it anyway. It commits the crime

Am I able to say, well, it had free will so I'm not responsible? ?‍

In other words, God is responsible for all the evil and every travesty and inconvenience in the world?

 

[Wetordry]

When I think of all the money I've spent for various shooting sports over the years....jeez.

 

[Stripped Rights]

Thus the reason Trannies are pushing it in the face of people that hate them

The people that hate them always say trannies are shoving it down their throat. Slip of the tongue or secret desire? You tell me.

 

[Ben Waylin]

The people that hate them always say trannies are shoving it down their throat. Slip of the tongue or secret desire? You tell me.

This reminds me of the time the Manhattan Project started manufacturing uranium 235, and by accident they made a bunch of this brand new element - Plutonium 239.

And Oppenheimer.. well, he gets all pissed off about the cost overruns and so he's all like, "What the fuck are we gonna do with all this plutonium."

Then, Edward Teller.. who is no relation to Edward Van Halen, well then he goes, "Wait a minute. Maybe we can blow up the plutonium !"

 

[CrazyNutz]

In other words, God is responsible for all the evil and every travesty and inconvenience in the world?

Im just laying it all out logically. If that's the conclusion you draw from it then I guess.

According to the bible he is responsible for all things.

The other conclusion you could draw is the whole story is false.

 

[VonBonfire]

Im just laying it all out logically. If that's the conclusion you draw from it then I guess.

According to the bible he is responsible for all things.

The other conclusion you could draw is the whole story is false.

It is the conclusion I draw. You aren't presenting a coherent argument because you can't show that foreknowledge somehow negates your own free will which you experience every minute of the day.

 

[JohnnyGtar]

No, that's just what scripture is saying.

Again, it's your moral judgment that what scripture is saying is trustworthy. You had to decide that.