What has the biggest impact on tone?

[Zachman]

Well if your so worried about the where tone comes from maybe you should take the time to find out. Youre full of shit

Coming from someone like you, that -- means -- Well... nothing really.

Enjoy your unplugged Tele on the couch tone.

Like I said:

Are you now out to prove that you lack impulse control, as well as any signs of intelligence?

Try again when you're old enough to buy beer, or up your dosage, so that you get your impulse control back-- to the point that you can make a lucid argument.

 

[70strathead]

its all subjective IMO. I personally think tone is embedded in the players mind/hands, personality and Attitude/Approach, and a good sounding Toneguitar and amp are added enhancements to create the sounds you are hearing, or want to hear. Im a big fan of great sounding guitars Tonethat strum and sound like a piano or acoustic. As far as what could impact it, not playing with ears and over abuse of effects...not that effects are bad, but if they are not dialed in right, it can impact your overall sound/tone. Practicing acoustically on a regular basis I've found will help u achieve good tone

..Spanish Fly - EVH, ALL HAND TONE!

Disagree... ALL HAND Technique... Guitar, mic, console and Engineering produced the recorded tone/sound

Wes Montgomery and Joe Pass never plugged in when practicing. they had serious tone!

good luck.
A

You KNOW I respect you, your playing, and your tones but if you replace where I have bolded "tone" with technique, I'd agree

All good man...I think there may be variartions on the definition of sound and tone though, or different perspectives...and when think of players that have great technique, not all of them IMO, have a good natural tone...or shall i say non appealing. Ok i'll say it, John Pettruci is one of them, amazing technician, but where's the tone? anyway, i know what u r saying and i will leave it with a quote from Chopin which is what i was relating :

"One needs only to study a certain positioning of the hand in relation to the keys to obtain with ease the most beautiful sounds, to know how to play long notes and short notes and to achieve certain unlimited dexterity. A well formed technique, it seems to me, can control and vary a beautiful sound quality."

 

[Digital Jams]

its all subjective IMO. I personally think tone is embedded in the players mind/hands, personality and Attitude/Approach, and a good sounding Toneguitar and amp are added enhancements to create the sounds you are hearing, or want to hear. Im a big fan of great sounding guitars Tonethat strum and sound like a piano or acoustic. As far as what could impact it, not playing with ears and over abuse of effects...not that effects are bad, but if they are not dialed in right, it can impact your overall sound/tone. Practicing acoustically on a regular basis I've found will help u achieve good tone

..Spanish Fly - EVH, ALL HAND TONE!

Disagree... ALL HAND Technique... Guitar, mic, console and Engineering produced the recorded tone/sound

Wes Montgomery and Joe Pass never plugged in when practicing. they had serious tone!

good luck.
A

You KNOW I respect you, your playing, and your tones but if you replace where I have bolded "tone" with technique, I'd agree

All good man...I think there may be variartions on the definition of sound and tone though, or different perspectives...and when think of players that have great technique, not all of them IMO, have a good natural tone...or shall i say non appealing. Ok i'll say it, John Pettruci is one of them, amazing technician, but where's the tone? anyway, i know what u r saying and i will leave it with a quote from Chopin which is what i was relating :

"One needs only to study a certain positioning of the hand in relation to the keys to obtain with ease the most beautiful sounds, to know how to play long notes and short notes and to achieve certain unlimited dexterity. A well formed technique, it seems to me, can control and vary a beautiful sound quality."

Great quote and one I need to remember and bring into my practice time.

 

[Zachman]

its all subjective IMO. I personally think tone is embedded in the players mind/hands, personality and Attitude/Approach, and a good sounding Toneguitar and amp are added enhancements to create the sounds you are hearing, or want to hear. Im a big fan of great sounding guitars Tonethat strum and sound like a piano or acoustic. As far as what could impact it, not playing with ears and over abuse of effects...not that effects are bad, but if they are not dialed in right, it can impact your overall sound/tone. Practicing acoustically on a regular basis I've found will help u achieve good tone

..Spanish Fly - EVH, ALL HAND TONE!

Disagree... ALL HAND Technique... Guitar, mic, console and Engineering produced the recorded tone/sound

Wes Montgomery and Joe Pass never plugged in when practicing. they had serious tone!

good luck.
A

You KNOW I respect you, your playing, and your tones but if you replace where I have bolded "tone" with technique, I'd agree

All good man...I think there may be variartions on the definition of sound and tone though, or different perspectives...and when think of players that have great technique, not all of them IMO, have a good natural tone...or shall i say non appealing. Ok i'll say it, John Pettruci is one of them, amazing technician, but where's the tone? anyway, i know what u r saying and i will leave it with a quote from Chopin which is what i was relating :

"One needs only to study a certain positioning of the hand in relation to the keys to obtain with ease the most beautiful sounds, to know how to play long notes and short notes and to achieve certain unlimited dexterity. A well formed technique, it seems to me, can control and vary a beautiful sound quality."

I hear you... and agree that the definitions of things such as: Tone, Sound, Style, Technique, Touch etc... would be beneficial to ALL.

I have agreed w/ Chopin, where I acknowledge that Good technique can coax nuances from gear that someone with lesser technique would not. Good form is a must... Good form with GREAT gear can ONLY serve to make the sound BETTER, because gear counts. I say this NOT because I think you don't know or acknowledge that, rather, because I want my thoughts on the matter to be clear for all who read them. GREAT gear and crap player = Crap performance -- Seems like something that goes without saying. GREAT player on crap gear may be a great performance with a shrill and less than appealing tone. Also seems like it goes without saying... But for some, apparently something like that gets missed along the way.

I do think Chopin would acknowledge the tone from a GREAT master built Piano and Violin etc... and differentiate the emotional content in one's technique/form used to execute an emotional performance of a musical piece, from the tonal qualities that the instruments (one of quality vs one of lesser quality) provide, or even make possible at all. Clearly the two are different things.

Playing well (Good technique/emotional attitude) don't require great gear, but the noticeable tone with the same guy playing on a superior instrument would be noticed (perhaps not by the novice listener, but by the experienced-- it is).

That's my take on it.

Either way, I prefer using tools which allow me to get the tones, I want/require (Either for myself or a client).

Our 'unplugged Tele on the couch' playing friend NOT withstanding.

 

[James Lugo]

I think everything impacts tone, player, guitar, pup, amp, cab, speaker, mic, pre etc... I've done scratch tracks with some of LA's best guitarist and when they play through Amp Farm it still sounds like Amp Farm. Fingers are one piece of the equation but not the whole equation and not the most important one for a lot of styles of playing. In drop tune modern rock the amp is nearly everything.

My 2 cents

 

[Zachman]

I think everything impacts tone, player, guitar, pup, amp, cab, speaker, mic, pre etc... I've done scratch tracks with some of LA's best guitarist and when they play through Amp Farm it still sounds like Amp Farm. Fingers are one piece of the equation but not the whole equation and not the most important one for a lot of styles of playing. In drop tune modern rock the amp is nearly everything.

My 2 cents

100% agree

 

[glassjaw7]

Definition of Tone:
-The overall quality of a musical sound.

A guitarist's technique/playing style/string attack WILL change this quality of sound.

BUT--The gear that he/she is playing through will change the quality of sound also, sometimes more and sometimes less.

And here is evidence of this:
Listen to the Dutch shootout. They re-amped the exact same signal through each amp so the player/technique is not a factor here, and the tone, or quality of sound changes from one amp to the next, and sometimes drastically.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZV8qXssejs

You can argue all you want about it, but when you think about what tone definitively is, then the only conclusion to this question is that both the player AND the gear have an effect on tone.

 

[Mailman1971]

Best example.......
interview I read MANY years ago.......

Ted Nugent said when he had a chance to plug into Eddie Van Halen's Rig.......
" I still sounded like me......."

'nuff said......

 

[Zachman]

Best example.......
interview I read MANY years ago.......

Ted Nugent said when he had a chance to plug into Eddie Van Halen's Rig.......
" I still sounded like me......."

'nuff said......

I bet if he plugged into George Benson's rig-- using George's settings, he wouldn't have sounded like he does through his rig.

 

[glassjaw7]

Any player will always retain their identity through any piece of gear, but the tone will still change.

The thing about a player that is recognizable is the WAY they play-a subtle bend here and there-the way they grip a chord-

But even listen to a guitarist's full catalog of music. Yeah, it all sounds like them because it IS, but the tone changes from album to album, usually because of different gear and production techniques.

There's really no argument here guys When the quality of sound changes, the tone changes. But players still sounds like themselves because of how they play.

 

[Zachman]

Any player will always retain their identity through any piece of gear, but the tone will still change.

The thing about a player that is recognizable is the WAY they play-a subtle bend here and there-the way they grip a chord-

But even listen to a guitarist's full catalog of music. Yeah, it all sounds like them because it IS, but the tone changes from album to album, usually because of different gear and production techniques.

There's really no argument here guys When the quality of sound changes, the tone changes. But players still sounds like themselves because of how they play.

Yes, that is STYLE/technique, not tone.

 

[jabps]

Good form? Good technique? Geeze now we've opened up another can of worms. Seriously what is good form or good technique? What some expert deems good or proper...no, it's what works for you. Shit, what works for you is the whole point to playing IMO. It's not $4000 Diezel or a $3000 Suhr or a $300 Agile or a $500 Crate. It's what works for you.

Now back to the OP's original thread topic, what has the biggest impact on tone? The player...it all starts with us. Simple as that.

 

[Zachman]

Good form? Good technique? Geeze now we've opened up another can of worms. Seriously what is good form or good technique? What some expert deems good or proper...no, it's what works for you. Shit, what works for you is the whole point to playing IMO. It's not $4000 Diezel or a $3000 Suhr or a $300 Agile or a $500 Crate. It's what works for you.

Now back to the OP's original thread topic, what has the biggest impact on tone?

The vantage point of the listener and their individual hearing capabilities, because no one is starting from the same starting point therefore different things will make a bigger impact for some than others.

The player...it all starts with us. Simple as that.

Well like in a fight, It may start w/ the player-- but it continues from there-- and like in a fight, the outcome is determined by the last blow, not the first-- and the gear continues from the what the player starts, and then it gets manipulated through the gear to provide the 'Final' audible result..

 

[glassjaw7]

Good form? Good technique? Geeze now we've opened up another can of worms. Seriously what is good form or good technique? What some expert deems good or proper...no, it's what works for you. Shit, what works for you is the whole point to playing IMO. It's not $4000 Diezel or a $3000 Suhr or a $300 Agile or a $500 Crate. It's what works for you.

Now back to the OP's original thread topic, what has the biggest impact on tone? The player...it all starts with us. Simple as that.

Listen to the playing in these videos. Same player. Same technique. DIFFERENT TONES! It's simple
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIx4freZCik
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQJq_Y6i_-c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EmBYZXgT-g

If that doesn't do it for you, think about those mini battery powered Fender amps. Instead of a multi-band eq they have a single TONE knob. Turn this knob and the tone changes drastically.

 

[Nigel]

I wonder if that boogie is biased cold.

That would make for shrillness.

Also, is the cab series wired?

Hi Nigel. I'm not sure how to measure the bias (had to google what that was actually). I looked inside the cab and it appears to be series wired. The speakers are each 16 ohm and connected to an 8 ohm input. Does the wiring have an influence?

Parallel is smoother, series is spikier in my experience. There are two bias settings on boogies, 6L6 and EL34. Either of those may or may not work depending on the tubes that are installed. If the tubes are biased cold, no amount of futzing with other aspects of the rig will get rid of the cold, shrill and lifeless toanz.

 

[lolzgreg]

1) player
2) player
3) player
4) player
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
1000) amp
1001) guitar

Exactly.

 

[jabps]

Good form? Good technique? Geeze now we've opened up another can of worms. Seriously what is good form or good technique? What some expert deems good or proper...no, it's what works for you. Shit, what works for you is the whole point to playing IMO. It's not $4000 Diezel or a $3000 Suhr or a $300 Agile or a $500 Crate. It's what works for you.

Now back to the OP's original thread topic, what has the biggest impact on tone? The player...it all starts with us. Simple as that.

Listen to the playing in these videos. Same player. Same technique. DIFFERENT TONES! It's simple
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIx4freZCik
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQJq_Y6i_-c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EmBYZXgT-g

If that doesn't do it for you, think about those mini battery powered Fender amps. Instead of a multi-band eq they have a single TONE knob. Turn this knob and the tone changes drastically.

I'm not debating the tone thing in this thread, I'll let you guys debate that till your blue in the face...what I questioning was...what is good form or proper technique, and my point being that there is none. It's what works for you as a player, regardless of those guys that tell you that "this is the proper way to hold your picking hand" ad nauseum. Tell that to EVH or Lynch, both unorthodox players yet both sound original and incredible.

The only thing I'll say about tone is that it starts with the player...the rest you guys can argue all you want.

 

[jabps]

Good form? Good technique? Geeze now we've opened up another can of worms. Seriously what is good form or good technique? What some expert deems good or proper...no, it's what works for you. Shit, what works for you is the whole point to playing IMO. It's not $4000 Diezel or a $3000 Suhr or a $300 Agile or a $500 Crate. It's what works for you.

Now back to the OP's original thread topic, what has the biggest impact on tone?

The vantage point of the listener and their individual hearing capabilities, because no one is starting from the same starting point therefore different things will make a bigger impact for some than others.

The player...it all starts with us. Simple as that.

Well like in a fight, It may start w/ the player-- but it continues from there-- and like in a fight, the outcome is determined by the last blow, not the first-- and the gear continues from the what the player starts, and then it gets manipulated through the gear to provide the 'Final' audible result..

The vantage point of the listener and their individual hearing capabilities, because no one is starting from the same starting point therefore different things will make a bigger impact for some than others.
Pretty much what I stated i.e "what works for you". I'll add to clarify...as a player and a listener.
Well like in a fight, It may start w/ the player-- but it continues from there-- and like in a fight, the outcome is determined by the last blow, not the first--
Not really a good analogy...I've seen alot of fights ended on the first punch...just sayin.Again, I'm not going to argue the point...you guys are entertaining enough however it starts with the player first and foremost, you guys can argue the rest.

 

[GRK]

I'm running out of different ways to word this but...

If you're a shitty player, you're a shitty player. You have 0 grove and you sound like shit through any amp regardless of technique. There are guys with amazing technique out there that still sound like shit cause they have 0 grove.

If you're a good player, you'll sound GOOD through ANY amp and guitar. That's why people keep saying "tone is in the fingers." Why do people have to analyze every single word of that phrase? All it means is THE PLAYER IS THE KEY TO GOOD TONE/MUSIC or WHATEVER THE FUCK YOU WANNA CALL IT. Put a tool infront of any amp out there and you'll not wanna listen to it. Hence why people say "tone is in the fingers." It's semantics when people try to take that phrase and spin it a million ways to try and prove it wrong. TONE IS IN THE PLAYER. If that phrase suits your philosophy better, hoofrigginray. Go crazy with it. Cause in the end it all means the same thing. So don't feel bad about your million dollar gear. If you're a good player, rock on brother. You deserve it. Now enjoy it.

That's all I wanna say.

 

[glpg80]

To me there are two things that a lot of folks confuse...Great playing and great tone.

Tone is a combination of gear and player.

Playing great is...hell, playing great. For instance, Satch will sound like Satch no matter what he's playing through. If it's a "great" rig it will sound like Satch playing through a great rig. If it's a shitty rig it will sound like Satch playing though a shitty rig...it will still be awesome playing...just shitty tone.

If you don't buy that, I challenge anybody on this forum to turn their treble all the way up and turn the bass and mids all the way down and then record a clip with that setup and show me the great tone.

in short this is the best way i've ever heard it explained. its a mix of both - each person can express themselves better through pieces of gear than others. however, whatever you play through is still a definition extension of who you are as a player. if both variables are excellent then you have great playing, and great tone.