Am I responsible for modifications that I did not mention in a listing?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Mark Skid
  • Start date Start date
I'm the buyer of the guitar. I failed to take notice of added strap knob. I should have noticed it, but I didn't. I asked the seller to re-route the guitar back to him for return and refund, but he refused. He feels that "Message me with any questions or more photos" was sufficient. I sent a message that I will consider keeping it, if he's willing to renegotiate the price. It's a fine guitar, but it's been modified. The "V" tail plate points have been bent slightly upward as well. I've sent pics of the pickups to Gibson, in an attempt to see if they may have been swapped. The labels look like they were peeled-away and placed on an alternate set of pickups. I could be wrong, I'm not sure? Both pickups read 7.4 Ohm, but that doesn't tell me much. It would be nice if Gibson stamped their p/u for ID.

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"E" Buckers were allegedly custom under-wound pups for Wildwood Guitars and dealer specific runs for them. Unless this guitar originated as a Wildwood spec Flying V there's a very good chance they were swapped. Agreed that wiring and the un-shrunk shrink wrap look suspect

Some info I found:
https://www.lespaulforum.com/index.php?threads/custom-buckers-e-buckers-difference.196288/page-2
 
"E" Buckers were allegedly custom under-wound pups for Wildwood Guitars and dealer specific runs for them. Unless this guitar originated as a Wildwood spec Flying V there's a very good chance they were swapped. Agreed that wiring and the un-shrunk shrink wrap look suspect

Some info I found:
https://www.lespaulforum.com/index.php?threads/custom-buckers-e-buckers-difference.196288/page-2
Yes, this exact guitar was originally sold by Wildwood. My 2018 R7 was a Wildwood with Custombuckers. The pickups that are in it now are NOT Custombuckers. Not from experience they aren't.

 
Will also add though that I didn't know that Gibson did a TV yellow V....that's pretty fricking cool...
 
Will also add though that I didn't know that Gibson did a TV yellow V....that's pretty fricking cool...
If could get it for less, and get Gibson to supply me with a replacement set of pickups, I'd consider keeping it. The seller is as obstinate as they come.
 
Not sure if you paid full price. But looks like this is what he paid.

https://guitarchimp.com/products/2014-gibson-custom-shop-59-reissue-flying-v-tv-yellow
The cost + tax was over $4500.00 USD. Yeah, I know... I've always wanted a 58/59 Flying V. It took days for me to justify the cost, but I figured that I could get my money back out of it. Had the guitar been what I thought it was going to be, I'd be fine with what I paid.

Did the seller purchase the guitar from Guitar Chimp, just so that he could harvest the E Bucker pickups? Are the pickups legit? Looking at the labels and wiring, I think not. No matter, it's going back.
 
The cost + tax was over $4500.00 USD. Yeah, I know... I've always wanted a 58/59 Flying V. It took days for me to justify the cost, but I figured that I could get my money back out of it. Had the guitar been what I thought it was going to be, I'd be fine with what I paid.

Did the seller purchase the guitar from Guitar Chimp, just so that he could harvest the E Bucker pickups? Are the pickups legit? Looking at the labels and wiring, I think not. No matter, it's going back.
I don’t know if the pickups are legit. Based on pictures, if they were replaced, it was done before the previous seller
 
I had a similar situation happen with a guitar purchase on ebay.
I posted about it here.
I won the dispute and eBay forced the return.
Best of luck with the dispute !
Dishonest people suck !
 
I had a similar situation happen with a guitar purchase on ebay.
I posted about it here.
I won the dispute and eBay forced the return.
Best of luck with the dispute !
Dishonest people suck !
I know it. Had I not been so gassed over the prospect of owning it, maybe I would have spotted it. He could have easily taken a photo that showed both strap buttons, and included a note in the listing.

If you look at the photos in the listing, you can see how he strategically took photos that do not show both strap buttons at the same time.

https://reverb.com/item/46744385-gibson-custom-shop-flying-v-59-reissue-t-v-yellow-w-ohsc-coa
 
I know it. Had I not been so gassed over the prospect of owning it, maybe I would have spotted it. He could have easily taken a photo that showed both strap buttons, and included a note in the listing.

If you look at the photos in the listing, you can see how he strategically took photos that do not show both strap buttons at the same time.

https://reverb.com/item/46744385-gibson-custom-shop-flying-v-59-reissue-t-v-yellow-w-ohsc-coa
Yeah.
That is exactly what the guy did to me.
Strategically took pics.
What helped is that his add said mint.
Well it was not mint.
I offered to even bring the guitar back to him for a refund.
He was semi local to me.
He refused and was a tool.
He tried to not return it.
That's when eBay forced it.
It did give me some faith in ebay.
It also made me look closer and ask more questions before purchasing.
The worst part is they know they are lying by omission !
 
Yeah.
That is exactly what the guy did to me.
Strategically took pics.
What helped is that his add said mint.
Well it was not mint.
I offered to even bring the guitar back to him for a refund.
He was semi local to me.
He refused and was a tool.
He tried to not return it.
That's when eBay forced it.
It did give me some faith in ebay.
It also made me look closer and ask more questions before purchasing.
The worst part is they know they are lying by omission !
I would have posted photos, along with a notation, simply to make sure the buyer doesn't miss anything.

I've sold tons of gear over the years, and I have never once had someone accuse me of anything sketchy. Years ago, a guy purchased a Way Huge Aqua-Puss reissue that was modified with a Panasonic delay chip. The delay chip was an upgrade, but for whatever reason, he took issue with the pedal. The listing clearly stated "modified with Panasonic chip", so I was confused as to why he asked for a return? I even included the Cool Audio chip that originally came with it.

A couple of people here purchased amps from me. I received glorious reviews from both. One guy has my RK100 amp that I'd love to get back.
 
I would have posted photos, along with a notation, simply to make sure the buyer doesn't miss anything.
So you didn't buy this from Guitar Chimp? Only bit of Devils Advocate stuff I'll throw out is that they guy may not have realized that the extra button was not in fact "a thing".....The strap button's are both clearly visible in both the guitar chimp and reverb listings. The pickup reading is in line with what those E pups read at, could very well have been a F up from Gibson as there is no neck or bridge designation on the stickers....

Flip side is if you've already talked yourself into spending that cash there are either killer replicas for less, maybe try to track down a Hamer Korina Vector, or just go for this brand new one!

https://reverb.com/item/46707536-2021-gibson-custom-58-mahogany-flying-v-reissue-vos-walnut-natural
or..

https://reverb.com/item/47274784-gi...ng-v-mahogany-vos-2017-tv-yellow-1959-reissue
or this one that I actually prefer over the rest with the Nickle hardware ;-)

https://reverb.com/item/46520816-gi...eissue-mahogany-flying-v-tv-black-silver-2017
 
So you didn't buy this from Guitar Chimp? Only bit of Devils Advocate stuff I'll throw out is that they guy may not have realized that the extra button was not in fact "a thing".....The strap button's are both clearly visible in both the guitar chimp and reverb listings. The pickup reading is in line with what those E pups read at, could very well have been a F up from Gibson as there is no neck or bridge designation on the stickers....

Flip side is if you've already talked yourself into spending that cash there are either killer replicas for less, maybe try to track down a Hamer Korina Vector, or just go for this brand new one!

https://reverb.com/item/46707536-2021-gibson-custom-58-mahogany-flying-v-reissue-vos-walnut-natural
or..

https://reverb.com/item/47274784-gi...ng-v-mahogany-vos-2017-tv-yellow-1959-reissue
or this one that I actually prefer over the rest with the Nickle hardware ;-)

https://reverb.com/item/46520816-gi...eissue-mahogany-flying-v-tv-black-silver-2017
Yes, both strap buttons are clearly visible in both listings, but... they are not visible in the same photo. This was how I missed it. One would have to be looking at a photo with the guitar angled in such a way that shows both buttons.

Example...

Screen Shot 2021-12-29 at 7.48.08 PM.png


As for the pickups, I'm not sure? They don't sound anything like the Wildwoods spec Custombuckers that were in my R7.
 
Seller is responsible to list any mods accident or not. Its sometimes hard to see in pics.
 
Is it possible the seller bought it not knowing about the electronic modifications?
 
Is it possible the seller bought it not knowing about the electronic modifications?
I'd say, yes... It's entirely possible. I've sold items that were modified without my knowledge. The difference between this seller and myself, is that I offered to have the items shipped back for a refund. I once sold a '72 Marshall Super Lead that had the signal caps replaced. I didn't know about, since I didn't open up the amp. I acquired two sets of mustard caps and sent him a full set at his request. I still have that second set.
 
As for the pickups, I'm not sure? They don't sound anything like the Wildwoods spec Custombuckers that were in my R7.
Could be two different versions.. The E versions are lower output Custombuckers. If you still have that R7 pull a pup and see what the sticker says. The tone difference could be the guitar too....I've got a Les Paul that started life as CC#29, which was then serial wiped and sold as a Wildwood Spec 58' that was then supposed to have Custom Buckers installed vs 57's that were originally in it as a CC. There are no stickers other than the PAF on those pups, but they don't sound a thing like the verified 57's in my one owner 07' 339.

Who knows, bottom line is that's a bunch of cash to spend, if you aint happy send it back and get your cash. That black one I posted is sick and a few hundred cheaper :rock:
 
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