Mike Oxhuge
Well-known member
Kinda what I was aluding to earlier and or if the speaker wire is undersized for handling 4 speakers.
jchrisf
Well-known member
I tried the two different wirings from the pics from Scumback and I did notice a big change. It could have been that it was hard getting the four 16 gauge stranded wires soldered on the output jack (because it was) but I'm pretty sure my connections were solid. They both had plenty of power and it was a big improvement over the stock stereo jack and thin wire setup.
the4thlast1
Well-known member
I think what happened here is because there are different wirings that look very similar. So when the scumback guy did his test with Dave at that time they did use two different circuits that gave a small difference in tone. One of them having two wires coming from the jack and the other having four. However the diagrams Scumback posted are most likely not what they used , at least one of them Is not. I would bet money on that , is there a tiny chance I’m wrong, sure. I’m always humble enough to say “hey I could be wrong” but another red flag to me is the unwillingness from the scumback guy to say something similar. Everyone makes mistakes.
Since I wasn’t there that day I can’t know for sure what they did. So if somehow they used those two diagrams and heard a difference then ok , wow. The only thing I could possibly think is happening is that by using the four wires at the jack you have created a branch circuit for each pair , therefore the full load of the circuit does not travel through every speaker. To hear a difference , I don’t know that’s a stretch. I think what I suggested above is much more likely.
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Scumback Speakers
Well-known member
Ok, my last post on this thread. Let's not forget that Dave & Roy build amps and wire cabinets. What's being suggested is that somehow/some way Dave, Roy & I didn't get the two wiring schemes right. But we did.
In post 185, jchrisf just said he tried both wiring setups and noticed a big difference using my wiring diagram.
Quote: "I tried the two different wirings from the pics from Scumback and I did notice a big change. It could have been that it was hard getting the four 16 gauge stranded wires soldered on the output jack (because it was) but I'm pretty sure my connections were solid. They both had plenty of power and it was a big improvement over the stock stereo jack and thin wire setup."
So there you have it. Someone tried my idea and noticed a big change. Thanks @jchrisf !
In post 185, jchrisf just said he tried both wiring setups and noticed a big difference using my wiring diagram.
Quote: "I tried the two different wirings from the pics from Scumback and I did notice a big change. It could have been that it was hard getting the four 16 gauge stranded wires soldered on the output jack (because it was) but I'm pretty sure my connections were solid. They both had plenty of power and it was a big improvement over the stock stereo jack and thin wire setup."
So there you have it. Someone tried my idea and noticed a big change. Thanks @jchrisf !
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Nigel
Well-known member
Jim,
That’s because he went from stock parallel series with a switch plate and tiny wire to series-parallel with decent wire.
Both of your diagrams are series/parallel aka parallel at the jack.
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Nigel
Well-known member
I got my ‘03 OS slant for $400 during the Covid war against humanity with a new slipcover. I consider it a gift from God.Since everyone now hates the OS cab, I'm still looking for an OS slant/straight from the 90s if anyone wants to get rid of one for cheap !
the4thlast1
Well-known member
You mentioned a "stock stereo jack" . Did you change from a stereo setup with left and right input jacks or change to a different type of mono jack? You also mentioned changing wire size ? It's hard to know what is producing the perceived difference in sound if you change several things at the same time.
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Jack Luminous
Well-known member
That's a pretty good deal ! I f*****g love my old OS slant cab. It's from '96. Been using it recently to test various power amps and it really delivers the goods IMHO ! I'm thinking hard about a slant/straight to go with it and make a nice looking/sounding full stack.
FourT6and2
Well-known member
Can we have more details about what we're talking about?
How was the cab wired before?
You then rewired it to the first diagram on Scumback's page?
You then rewired it to second diagram on Scumback's page?
Go back to post 172. Which wiring schemes are you talking about?
I'm about over this whole conversation though haha. I'm not trying to discount anybody's experience in a hostile way, but it's like a home owner telling an electrician they moved an outlet from one wall to the other wall, without actually changing how anything was wired, and now their TV's colors are move vivid. But look, if you're happy with what you're hearing, awesome—I'm truly happy for you.
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jchrisf
Well-known member
My 1960B stereo switch started malfunctioning recently so I just rewired it myself rather than buy another one of these...What I'm saying is I think you have the nomenclature backward. Bogner's cabs are wired parallel/series, not series/parallel. Either way, whatever you call it, I think you're point is you like this first wiring method?
Bogner's cabs are like this, which is parallel-series...
This is series-parallel:
jchrisf
Well-known member
I put a mono jack in with new wire and tried both of the wiring diagrams on Scumbacks site for 4x12s
thegame
Well-known member
AND found a difference between the two?
A
acalaf
Active member
Great thread! I finally understand the wiring difference. will try series/parallel on a slant marshall with mesa v30s soon and report back. It has the stock mesa wiring now.
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Nigel
Well-known member
I think you'll love it! Use the Aiken diagram and you can wire up a single pole, single throw switch to add in one wire and go from S/P to P/S on the fly, like a Rock/Metal or Vintage/Modern switch or something. Or if not, you can easily go back to P/S with that one wire.
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Nigel
Well-known member
Mesa OS mastery:
311boogieman
Well-known member
Wait, your Marshall cab has Pre-Gibson wiring?
A
acalaf
Active member
haha. I wired it the stock mesa way on purpose when i put the mesa v30s in there.
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acalaf
Active member
OK, so I rewired my Marshall cab with Mesa V30s in series parallel. The change is pretty noticeable. It feels like the mids are fuller, the bass deeper and the highs clearer. The change is noticeable enough that I think it is worth doing.
It almost feels like this should be the correct wiring for a cab. It sounds closer to a single 1 by 12. The parallel series wiring seems to subtract frequencies. I’m guessing that Mesa and Marshall chose this type of wiring simply so they could have the stereo option in the cabinets. It doesn’t seem like it was a choice made out of pure tone considerations, but that’s just speculation on my part.
Here’s a picture of the wiring that I used.
It almost feels like this should be the correct wiring for a cab. It sounds closer to a single 1 by 12. The parallel series wiring seems to subtract frequencies. I’m guessing that Mesa and Marshall chose this type of wiring simply so they could have the stereo option in the cabinets. It doesn’t seem like it was a choice made out of pure tone considerations, but that’s just speculation on my part.
Here’s a picture of the wiring that I used.
Attachments
K
Kagami
Active member
In a 2x12 configuration a series wiring will have less damping and sound more lively than a parallel which has more motor control (damping) and will be tighter. How this exactly works into a 4x12 wiring I'm not entirely sure but it would explain the difference between S-P and P-S if it works the same way.
FourT6and2
Well-known member
Totally. And what I'm pointing out is that you have to actually rewire the cab from S-P to P-S or vice versa. The issue is that some of these wiring diagrams people are using depict the SAME EXACT wiring for S-P or P-S and simply show a wire moved to a different location, yet still connected to the same point in the circuit. The diagrams are wrong.
If someone actually rewires their cab correctly and changes the circuit, and hears a difference, that's completely within reason.
