Someone please tell me what the deal is with Blackmachine?

[steve_k]

I saw that Doug's own BM guitar was up for sale this last 6 months. Can't remember how much it fetched, but I 'think' it was up in the order of £6K.

What sort of figure/range are the privileged few looking at for a new build B2?

That turned into a private bidding war and it ended up selling for 8600 Pounds, if I remember correctly.

 

[RJF]

15-20 grand for a freakin' bolt on? Lame.

you say that like bolt ons are inferior which is just so not the case

I am saying that. Bolt ons feel like garbage to me. Nothing like a neck through.

 

[polaris20]

Most people realize that a Bolt-on sounds better. Unless you prefer bolting your pickups to a bunch of pieces of wood glued together. You lose attack, resonance and sustain with a neck-thru.

You get a different attack, yes. But anyone who's been playing for awhile knows the rest is just personal preference. Resonance and sustain don't suffer on set necks and neck throughs, if they're properly built.

 

[engage757]

I've been lurking here for a while now but felt compelled to register here just to clear up a few things in this thread that are potentially misleading.

Doug is definitely a) still building and b) doing this full-time. When it comes to the B2/B7/F8 instruments, it's a completely one-man operation. He is snowed under with offers and requests which can give the impression he isn't building but it isn't true - the logistics of the situation force him to just have to 'pick and choose' his builds so to speak.

The suggestion he's a part-timer or some-such really isn't fair - he is an utterly committed builder and totally dedicated to the continued refinement of his instruments. I met with him last week and he was enthusing about some new developments he was planning on implementing. He had a couple of newly-built instruments with him and they were outstanding. The massive second-hand prices are purely a supply/demand issue - not the builder's fault, he certainly isn't seeing that cash!

The B6 guitars are part-built by Feline Guitars (another excellent London-based builder). The B6 waiting list alone is over 50 names long right now apparently, not sure if they've closed the book for a while on these. This certainly adds to the sense of unobtainability I guess!

I purchased my B2 back in 2004 when no-one really knew much about these guitars. The net hype that's taken place since is astonishing really which is unfortunate in some ways as it does a bit of a disservice to someone who's only real interest is in building the best guitars that he can. They aren't for everyone certainly - but they more than work for me.

You. Are wrong. Doug is a part-time builder. He has a career outside of guitar building. The B6 is entirely built by Jon from Feline and at times inspected by Doug at final set-up. Stealth can attest to the fact that we are both friends with Doug and Jon and speak with them often, at times, daily. Doug is currently building a couple in-stock guitars, and he also has a ten person waiting list from early 2013 that is just beginning.

I spoke with Jon yesterday. I spoke with Doug today.

 

[animal]

not exactly what i call a great example for tone when you get the same sound with a pod and a broomstick

I shouldn't be too harsh maybe its made out of the same exotic woods all these guys run after

 

[engage757]

I guess, given that the B6 models are currently made by someone else, without any of the trimmings & exotic tops, & retail (apparently) for £2300, we're still probably looking at B2 guitars well in excess of £3000 & a horrific waiting list no doubt?

Be good to put the customer order price of B2 guitars into perspective for everyone. Maybe then people can debate whether or not they justify their cost.

There is no waiting list. There are 10 builds that were released last year. That's the closest for a waiting list they have.

Only for the b6. :/

 

[crankyrayhanky]

I'm not sure how much they are direct, but if I'm busting my ass making guitars so people can flip them at insane prices, why would you continue sales- just go eBay auction on everything?
Retire in 5 years

 

[engage757]

I'm not sure how much they are direct, but if I'm busting my ass making guitars so people can flip them at insane prices, why would you continue sales- just go eBay auction on everything?
Retire in 5 years

Which is probably why he only builds part-time, and puts them up for sale at a best offer type thing. The last one sold for over $14.5k!

 

[Les Zombie]

i enjoy reading these blackmachine threads.

 

[rocknrolla]

I'm convinced.
Given the right marketing and a little word of mouth in the right circles and guitarists will take a second mortgage on their houses without even seeing or hearing a product first hand.

 

[Invidious]

I'm convinced.
Given the right marketing and a little word of mouth in the right circles and guitarists will take a second mortgage on their houses without even seeing or hearing a product first hand.

On some forums I could not agree more. When one guy has something, everyone wants it. Not so much in here though it seems from what I have been reading.

I would love to play one of these guitars even just once to see what the big deal is all about. Even if I had the money I just could never see spending more than 5000 on a guitar but that's me. To each their own.

 

[IHateRap]

How do the fanned tuning machines contribute to the overall experience?

 

[steve_k]

How do the fanned tuning machines contribute to the overall experience?

Gonna need a bigger headstock soon if he builds a B9.

 

[engage757]

How do the fanned tuning machines contribute to the overall experience?

Experience with a pair of pliers adjusting a nut? Like basic maintenance?

 

[jlbaxe]

How do the fanned tuning machines contribute to the overall experience?

And you can use the head stock/stings to slice cheese at parties between sets

Id take my impact drill/driver and screw a Guinness bottle opener right on the front lower corner

 

[joepete77]

How do the fanned tuning machines contribute to the overall experience?

Is that a scarf joint I see ?

 

[Schaf]

This kind of sucks for those of us dreaming to one day buy a TA or Suhr

Well they aren't bad instruments. Its just like comparing a nice BMW to a lambo or a ferrari. The BMW is still fucking awesome but you can't compare it to a high end super car.

See, I don't think this is a good comparison at all. Your personal opinion is the BM is a Lambo or Ferrari and the others are BMWs. For someone else, a Tom Anderson or a Suhr might be the Ferrari and the BM might be the BMW. It is a matter of personal preference. Different strokes for different folks. Not every player is going to find the BM superior regardless of the price.

Steve

I dunno, to me the BMs are in a category of their own, similar to Ruokangas, Gil Yaron, Gustav, Myka, ViK, etc.

To each their own though.

That's your opinion, to which you are entitled, and for you, it's true and that's why you are willing to lay out the cash for one. Other's might have different thoughts on the matter. I just wish their thoughts were not to insult you for your opinion and buying decisions. That is just ignorant and I see a lot of that type of ignorance in this thread... As I said, I've laid out a lot of cash for a Bartlett and I'm 1.5 years and a lot more dollars from a guitar (at best). And I'm sure plenty of folks responding about the BM in this thread would ridicule me for that as well. I think that's dumb. Who cares what you or I do with our cash?

That said I do think it's a bit arrogant to say that a BM is fundamentally "better" than something like a custom Suhr or Anderson or other nice high end guitar that might be less expensive to buy. "Better for me" would be a better, less arrogant way to discuss it. I also do understand why some are turned off when people who own them are discussing the ownership as if it is some exclusive club that they can't afford to be in so they should just butt out of commenting... It's also clear that rig-talk is made up of a wide variety of folks with widely varying incomes and responsibilities and I understand some folks thinking it ridiculous to pay $15K for a guitar (or $5K or $3K really). I just wish they wouldn't describe people doing so as "idiots". If you earn $30K/year, you'd be an idiot to do it, but if you make $500K per year, it would be like the $30K guy buying a Squier strat. Might want to consider that before calling someone an idiot for doing something that others can't... Two sides to the story that lead to the controversy and acrimony in this thread really...

IMHO... YMMV... etc. etc. etc....

Steve

I really don't agree with the comparison with the cars either. There's just a whole lot more going on to technologically speaking. It's just hard for me to fathom that a guitar can play, look or sound $12,000 better than a well set up Les Paul, Suhr or Anderson. To me, if you want to spend your money on that, then that's your business. But, I find it hard to believe that it's THAT much better of a guitar as say Steve's CS Charvel stuff. But then again, I've never played one. But I have played a lot of guitars. And even the very best I've played, sounded or played maybe 5% better than my LP, tops? That's a lot of coin for 5%. I'm thinking I could just invest more time in practicing and get that 5% and cost me nothing but time. But then again, I don't have a BM and not part of that elite club.

There are very few things that sustain that kind of inflated value. Maybe I'm wrong on this one but, I seriously doubt in 10 years that they'll be what they are worth today. So if it were me, Itake my money and go buy 3 Suhrs and 2 Andersons. And, I say that because, we as musicians, are very fickle people. And, again this is my opinion, and I don't harbor any resentment for anyone that owns a BM guitar because even if I did have the cash, it's just not my thing.

 

[Code001]

Is that a scarf joint I see ?

Yes, why?

 

[joepete77]

Is that a scarf joint I see ?

Yes, why?

It's just that I wAs surprised to see a scarf joint on a guitar in that price range, but to be honest I didn't know much about these.

 

[steve_k]

bump