When a custom builder loses interest.

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UberschallEL34":hleo90tf said:
throw the dude under the bus, sounds like a prick. if you're worried about getting the deposit back just be up front with them and tell them how you've come to the decision to walk. then walk
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I don't think it's cool to ever "throw someone under the bus," regardless of the situation. While I'm on the poster's side at the moment, there are two sides to this story. We only have one side right now.
 
good point...my emotions for this guys frustrations got me fired up! ahahah
 
I'd definitely walk in your case. But with that said, the guy is likely just as much of the artist mindset as you are. You don't do this to get rich, even if he is doing well. So if this guy's passion is building uber quality LPs and such, it's really not surprising that he's not into doom. So while it's not fair to you, I'm not that surprised he feels this way. Him letting you know he feels this way tells me he's not desperate for your business.
 
I'm not going to throw the guy under the bus, it's not my style, and wouldn't help anything, not to mention, I'm not pissed. but at the moment, I do have a really bad taste in my mouth about it, and what last week was a lot of excitement has turned into frustration at not being able to get advice on fundamental aspects of the build. The quotes in my post above are not verbatim, I removed names and particulars, but the sentiment is pretty much intact. Don't get me wrong, the guy hasn't been rude. He has actually been pretty polite, but he has been extremely unhelpful, starting the day I put down the deposit and also sent the clip. Prior to the clip and deposit, he was emailing me several times per day, telling me how excited the builder was to build the guitar, how he remembered building the guitar my buddy owned and what a great guitar it was, how beautiful the guitar would be with XXX finish, etc. Every question I asked got a "let me ask the builder." followed by, "the builder really thinks that..." Now, no mention of the builder at all, even when I ask.

At this point, I have clearly asked several times about what pickups to use, and have not gotten any answers. Before the deposit/clip, he gave me a list of pickup makers they use, and told me all about their strong and weak points, what kind of tones they were good for, etc. Afterwards, as I mentioned above, all he would say is, "Well, we have X Brand pickups used coming out of our buddy XXX's guitar, it'll be easiest if you just use those. If you don't like them, it'll be easy to sell them afterwards." No real mention or explanation about how they would help me achieve my tone. When I pressed him on it, saying, well, I looked up those pickups, they have a pretty mild output rating, why did you suggest them, I didn't get any real answer. Then when I made some suggestions of my own, like what about BKP pickups, or what about Lace pickups, or what about a custom wind from XX Brand that you use frequently?" He ignored all of my suggestions, did not talk about the BKP's or whatever at all, and repeated that I should use his buddy's pickups. When I asked him how they would help my tone, he told me, "I'm an old fart - and very old school (Jazz/Blues/Steely/) so I'm the last guy you want to listen to about tone," (verbatim quote). He also mentioned that "there's no guitar left in the signal" in the clip I sent. The part that really got to me was that I specifically asked him, if you don't know much about tone, what does the builder think I should use? This question was ignored, with yet another suggestion that I use their buddy's pickups. At this point, he's told me to just get back to him when I figure out what pickups I want.

I'm trying to take a few days to chill on it, but I'm pretty much in the same place as all the above comments.
 
not sure how much you're looking to spend on this guy's work...but somewhere the communication must have gotten lost in translation. your best bet would be to call him up ad discuss what you're looking for. a quality builder should be able to translate tone of a specific voicing into what components go into making that tone happen. sounds from this clip remind me of an SG or les paul...pickups sound very low output PAF style. if you would have sent him this clip and want to achieve this tone with high output pups you may need to reconsider pickup choice, not so say a high output pickup can't do doom...this clip was vintage PAF tone IMHO
 
that's fine, and that's why I asked him, and the kind of thing it would be nice if he would say. also, I've already called him, and gotten the same type of responses. also, for what it's worth, I'm pretty sure that band uses Lace pickups in PRS style guitars into Sunn Model T amps. or at least the singer does.
 
so essentially a High on Fire tone is something you'd be after...in a sense? any builder should be able to get this done. perhaps send the guy the pups you want in the guitar and tell him his buddies reject pickups aren't going in your guitar :D
 
i dont really think which tone it is matters. it's the fact that he's not helping me figure it out and I'm paying him several thousand for a custom guitar, which clearly has no interest in at this point.
 
not sure why you'd even consider having someone build you a guitar that isn't willing to help you, in saying that I mean it sounds like you've made up your mind already (not being snide)...there's plenty of companies that would like that kind of $$ and can do a great job. on a side not, and again don't take this the wrong way - if you're looking to spend $3k + on a guitar most folks just tell the builder what they want. this guy may be wanting you to decide so he can get rocking. pickups are a key component for sure but if you were going to ask guys on here what they'd order I bet you'd have 99% know which wood for the body, neck and which pups they'd put in it. Hopefully the guy is not gonna ask you to decide on Floyd Rose or TOM bridge ;)
 
i know what I want, and have told him specifically so. I played one of his guitars and told him "I want that guitar. That model, those woods, just in a different color and with different pups" and his sales guy has been trying to talk me into something else at every step of the way. For instance, I told him I wanted just a bridge pup because I never use the neck, and he has been relentless about telling me I really need to put a neck pup in. I told him I wanted BKP Warpigs or some Lace pups and he has ignored that and repeatedly told me to just use this used set of Voodoos, mentioning several times that it would be easier and cheaper for him. etc. Not really sure why I'm explaining myself so much to someone who 10 posts up told me to throw him under the bus.
 
so who is the builder building for then? simple as that...what you want or what they want. more reason to move on, or just say NO :gethim:
 
Have you talked to the builder directly or just this sales rep/builder buddy? Why don't you talk to the builder directly about your concerns and ask him flat out if he cares all that much about what you get and if not part ways.
 
Get out dude. Get out NOW, before this whole lame exercise sours you on a custom build. My guy is interested, cares, asks for sound clips, does research on pups and woods and glues and what not, and fwds ALL that info to me to help me make a decision, in addition to follow up calls and texts and emails and about 1000 pics for each build. Forget this guy; there are plenty of luthiers out there that would love to work with you. Get your $ back and walk and never look back.

It sounds to me like he's got a certain image in his head about what his guitars should look like, sound like, and be used for and your guitar doesn't fit that image, (I.E.CORK-SNIFFER) so he's not interested in it. Fuck that.
 
Steinmetzify":3l0b1rqv said:
Get out dude. Get out NOW, before this whole lame exercise sours you on a custom build. My guy is interested, cares, asks for sound clips, does research on pups and woods and glues and what not, and fwds ALL that info to me to help me make a decision, in addition to follow up calls and texts and emails and about 1000 pics for each build. Forget this guy; there are plenty of luthiers out there that would love to work with you. Get your $ back and walk and never look back.

It sounds to me like he's got a certain image in his head about what his guitars should look like, sound like, and be used for and your guitar doesn't fit that image, so he's not interested in it. Fuck that.
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what he said +1
 
i'm going to take a WILD guess at this one:

...my GUESS is that somewhere along the line, a price was mis-quoted. And now the builder realizes that seeing your project through to completion is going to cost him time and money, and any sense of profit is gone.

He's trying to finish your project with the cheapest and fastest methods available, so he doens't go in the red.

And with his short answers, he's probably HOPING that you'll pull the plug.

Again. I'm totally guessing here....
 
Steinmetzify":coyk3k9b said:
Get out dude. Get out NOW, before this whole lame exercise sours you on a custom build. My guy is interested, cares, asks for sound clips, does research on pups and woods and glues and what not, and fwds ALL that info to me to help me make a decision, in addition to follow up calls and texts and emails and about 1000 pics for each build. Forget this guy; there are plenty of luthiers out there that would love to work with you. Get your $ back and walk and never look back.

It sounds to me like he's got a certain image in his head about what his guitars should look like, sound like, and be used for and your guitar doesn't fit that image, (I.E.CORK-SNIFFER) so he's not interested in it. Fuck that.
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already drafting the email.
 
so a little update. I cancelled the order and the sales guy has written me back twice. first email he sounded quite irritated that I was unhappy with things, explained that he hadnt helped with pup selection because he didn't know anything about heavy music, and then offered to do everything he could to make me happy with the order and apologized. I didn't write back immediately (less than a day) because i've been very busy. He wrote again, and again offered to help in any way possible. But then, he said he hadn't told the builder about my complaints because he didn't see any "point in potentially damaging the relationship between you and (the builder) if we can find our way around this little speed bump," and that the builder had already started on my guitar, and had glued the top to the body. It does seem the guy is genuinely trying to be helpful, but the "damaging the relationship" thing is a little weird. and now i feel like an ass cancelling a guitar that's been started.
 
I don't understand why you don't just talk directly to the builder. This guy sounds like he hasn't communicated your questions to the builder at all and is suddenly faced with explaining to the builder why this guy, who the builder maybe was completely unaware was unhappy, wants to cancel. He's trying to cover his ass and the chop about blowing off your queries because he doesn't know heavy music is utter bullshit and horrible customer service. Again maybe the builder himself would have had ideas himself or points of contact to help steer you. "Relationship with the builder". WTF is that! You guys going to BBQ or go to a ballgame together? Watch each other's kids? You're paying him to provide a certain service that they are falling way short on. How about the damage they've already done to your relationship with them.

Bypass this guy and talk to the builder, go from there. I wouldn't worry about what he started. They were fine pawning parts and pieces off to you so they obviously can put whatever's he done to use elsewhere :lol: :LOL:
 
yeah, i'd like to know why i haven't talked to the builder as well.
 
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